Astronomers confirm faintest early-universe galaxy ever seen

[MarkFL]

Astronomers confirm faintest early-universe galaxy ever seen

Scientists have detected and confirmed the faintest early-universe galaxy ever, using the W. M. Keck Observatory on the summit on Mauna Kea in Hawaii. The team detected the galaxy as it was 13 billion years ago.

 

[Alithis]

how do they know it was 13 billion years ago ?

 

[MarkFL]

how do they know it was 13 billion years ago ?

I'm no expert, however I would assume they can measure the distance from us to them (and hence how long the light has been traveling) by measuring the red-shift of the light. In an expanding universe, the further something is from an observer, the more its light will be shifted to towards the red end of the spectrum (Doppler effect).

 

[Alithis]

what if the perceived source is moving away from them at a speed greater then the speed of light ?

 

[MarkFL]

what if the perceived source is moving away from them at a speed greater then the speed of light ?

Then the object will be "beyond the horizon" and we wouldn't be able to see it.

 

[MarkFL]

An interesting thing about our event horizon, is that in a universe that is expanding at an ever quickening pace (as has been confirmed), we will be able to see less and less of it (the ratio of the portion we see to the whole) as time progresses...that is, objects would can see today, we won't be able to see at some point in the future...galaxies will "blink out" as they cross the threshold of our horizon.

If the rate of expansion of the universe continues to increase long enough, we won't be able to see any galaxies outside of our own Milky Way, and eventually, stars within our own galaxy will begin disappearing until eventually, all we will be able to see is our own solar system...and so on until every fundamental particle is isolated from every other, and perhaps even until every atom of spacetime (spacetime, like matter and energy, is discrete rather than continuous) is alone as well.

 

[Alithis]

so if the universe is expanding at an increasing pace (and as it is increasing do they really know at what pace?) then there is no way they can be sure of the age of an object that is moving away from us by the light traveling to us .
too mush guess work involved .
but it does stand with the bible which states god spread out the heaven (and they are still spreading ) wonder how the writer could possibly have know that .hmmm

 

[MarkFL]

Scientists typically rely on several methods simultaneously that co-exist within the same theoretical framework and thus all converge and narrow in on a range of accuracy. There is always a margin of error in anything that is measured though. Science is a dynamic self-correcting process that advances with increasingly improved models, scientific theories that arise from these models, and better methods of measurement.

Here's an article about how the expansion rate has been measured:

Speed of Universe's Expansion Measured Better Than Ever

Here's an article about the increasing rate of expansion and when it began (at about the same time our solar system was forming):

Accelerating expansion of the universe

 

[TubbyTubby]

so if the universe is expanding at an increasing pace (and as it is increasing do they really know at what pace?) then there is no way they can be sure of the age of an object that is moving away from us by the light traveling to us .
too mush guess work involved .
but it does stand with the bible which states god spread out the heaven (and they are still spreading ) wonder how the writer could possibly have know that .hmmm

What exactly does the bible say about the age or size of the Universe?

 

[MoreCoffee]

What exactly does the bible say about the age or size of the Universe?

Not very much; some read into it various modern ideas about cosmology.

 

[TubbyTubby]

Not very much; some read into it various modern ideas about cosmology.

I was interested in what you were hinting with your statement "wonder how the writer could possibly have know that .hmmm". This suggests some great insight to me.

Also, you shouldn't be so dismissive of science without reading each subject, it most definitely does not employ guesswork - it's the opposite of guessing. The rate of expansion is known and easy to check if you were bothered.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I was interested in what you were hinting with your statement "wonder how the writer could possibly have know that .hmmm". This suggests some great insight to me.

Also, you shouldn't be so dismissive of science without reading each subject, it most definitely does not employ guesswork - it's the opposite of guessing. The rate of expansion is known and easy to check if you were bothered.

It was not me that wrote wonder how the writer could possibly have know that .hmmm when I read it I wondered what arcane interpretation of ordinary words in holy scripture would be turned to some cosmological purpose by its author ( [MENTION=61]Alithis[/MENTION] ). Only time will tell. As for me I think of ancient Hebrew cosmology as dealing with what's observable with an unaided eye and without the kind of curiosity that some of the ancient Greek philosophers showed. The holy scriptures suggest a cosmological map something like this:

This is not the view of 21st century cosmology, but it is an understandable observation based model for its times.

 

[Alithis]

Oh good grief.. That could not be a more carnal minded picture lol . it doesnt translate the "sphere" at all.but it is humerous.
As a child i had no more then the same scriptures they had and i pictured nothing like that. Nor would i try to draw it.
All mans wisdom looks like a pack of fools to God.. So many are going to be so embarrassed .
As to the question of " i wonder hiw thw writer could have known that? In regard to the heavens being spread out(perpetually spreading) why would it be such a mystery .the pattern of growth and increace is seen in everything of life untill it reaches the limits of its predesigned proportions.
But i dontknow the asker..is the asker a aelf declared atheist ? If so. Then -end

 

[TubbyTubby]

why would it be such a mystery .the pattern of growth and increace is seen in everything of life untill it reaches the limits of its predesigned proportions.
But i dontknow the asker..is the asker a aelf declared atheist ? If so. Then -end

That is not a known law of nature. There are no "predesigned" limits that we know of for the universe. Give me an example where this pattern is seen.

 

[TubbyTubby]

It was not me that wrote wonder how the writer could possibly have know that .hmmm when I read it I wondered what arcane interpretation of ordinary words in holy scripture would be turned to some cosmological purpose by its author ( [MENTION=61]Alithis[/MENTION] ). Only time will tell. As for me I think of ancient Hebrew cosmology as dealing with what's observable with an unaided eye and without the kind of curiosity that some of the ancient Greek philosophers showed. The holy scriptures suggest a cosmological map something like this:

This is not the view of 21st century cosmology, but it is an understandable observation based model for its times.

Exactly, that's how I understood bible scripture to explain the Universe which is why I can't understand how the poster suggests some interpretation equates to the modern known size or age of the Universe.

 

[MarkFL]

...All mans wisdom looks like a pack of fools to God...

If God considers the wisdom of men to be foolish (of which cosmology would certainly be a part), how does this align with Proverbs 18:15? Certainly God would want men to seek to understand the universe which He created, right?