Jesus will save you if you.... ???

[Lamb]

I just want to be clear and understand what you are saying. Correct me if I am wrong, but are you saying that, we don't have to repent? That either God grants us repentance or He doesn't?

We repent because God works repentance within us. We do repent. It's also God working within us to bring us to repentance. There is no conflict.

 

[Edward429451]

We do the works that God has planned for us to do...we do them with his leading/guidance, but yes, we're doing them. I'm sorry you got confused but I thought I was clear on what I had posted previously. God works through us, the scriptures are very clear on that.

We repent because God turns us to Him. We can't repent on our own and have no power to do it, it's another work of God within us. Repentance isn't just sorrow from sins, but also turning to God in faith and faith is from God.

Interesting. We do know that God never changes, right?

So if God planned everything we will do, then...He planned for Adam & Eve to fall?
He planned for Jonah to run away from Nineveh instead of going there? If that is so, then where is our free will? Don't we have to make a decision? A choice?
So if a homosexual wants to join the church and be a member, and has not repented of being a homo, then go ahead and accept them in and, God will grant them repentance later when He wants to?

Some aspects of what you have said are true. But other parts suggest things that, are hard to swallow.

Can you give me an example of the Holy Spirit working through you to do whatever His will was at the time? What happened? Holy Spirit said to you, do this or that, and you agreed and did it? And then what came of it?

I think that part of my problem with your position is that, You have not personalized anything at all. You have the doctrine, and say God does this in us, God does that...and never a word about you in that situation.

 

[Edward429451]

We repent because God works repentance within us. We do repent. It's also God working within us to bring us to repentance. There is no conflict.

Ok. I agree with that doctrine as stated.

But could you perhaps give me an example or two? Make it real life for me and beyond the doctrine...?

 

[Creed]

I just want to be clear and understand what you are saying. Correct me if I am wrong, but are you saying that, we don't have to repent? That either God grants us repentance or He doesn't?

No, God requires everybody to repent. But because nobody ever will on their own, God has to grant them that ability.

 

[Nic]

As near as I can tell, God asks four things of man.
To humble ourselves.
Pray.
Seek His Face.
Turn from our wicked ways.

Other things are a given, right? Like, Obey, be a doer of the word and apply it to our lives and so forth.

Being perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect is probably more than four things. Perhaps, you are making use of a shorthand for perfectionism, is that it? A perfectionism that is the same as the command, be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect. Is that a fair rendering of what you're saying? Thanks.

 

[Edward429451]

No, God requires everybody to repent. But because nobody ever will on their own, God has to grant them that ability.

but then we still repent. I'll buy that.

 

[Edward429451]

Being perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect is probably more than four things. Perhaps, you are making use of a shorthand for perfectionism, is that it? A perfectionism that is the same as the command, be perfect as your heavenly Father is perfect. Is that a fair rendering of what you're saying? Thanks.

I thought about that after I posted it and it is more than 4 things. I didn't intend for it to be shorthand for perfectionism but you got it about right. Lamb had me thinking that we don't do nothing and aren't required to do works or anything and she sounded like she was making a doctrine out of it, and the scriptures are chok full of commandments! Do this do that. Don't do it that way, do it this way. But yes, that's what it says, be ye perfect even as your Father in Heaven is perfect. We have a lot to do,

 

[Lamb]

but then we still repent. I'll buy that.

Of course we repent, but God is the one causing it to happen.

I thought about that after I posted it and it is more than 4 things. I didn't intend for it to be shorthand for perfectionism but you got it about right. Lamb had me thinking that we don't do nothing and aren't required to do works or anything and she sounded like she was making a doctrine out of it, and the scriptures are chok full of commandments! Do this do that. Don't do it that way, do it this way. But yes, that's what it says, be ye perfect even as your Father in Heaven is perfect. We have a lot to do,

You have quite a way of twisting words around that I haven't said.

Let's start with the topic of this thread. I thought everyone pretty much agreed that we don't save ourselves? That God saves us.

Now that we're justified because of Christ Jesus, God is working in us. The works that WE DO, we are doing because the Holy Spirit is working within us. We're doing them. Why does this seem to be an issue with you?

 

[Edward429451]

Of course we repent, but God is the one causing it to happen.



You have quite a way of twisting words around that I haven't said.

Let's start with the topic of this thread. I thought everyone pretty much agreed that we don't save ourselves? That God saves us.

Now that we're justified because of Christ Jesus, God is working in us. The works that WE DO, we are doing because the Holy Spirit is working within us. We're doing them. Why does this seem to be an issue with you?

I'm not twisting your words. You havent been being clear with what you say. At least to me, you're hard to talk to and your vagueness made it seem to me one way when it is another way.

Over quite a few pages I have been able to piece it together about you. So why are you getting so defensive about it? If you'd speak more clearly I could understand you faster.

 

[Nic]

I thought about that after I posted it and it is more than 4 things. I didn't intend for it to be shorthand for perfectionism but you got it about right. Lamb had me thinking that we don't do nothing and aren't required to do works or anything and she sounded like she was making a doctrine out of it, and the scriptures are chok full of commandments! Do this do that. Don't do it that way, do it this way. But yes, that's what it says, be ye perfect even as your Father in Heaven is perfect. We have a lot to do,

How much perfect obedience or perfection is necessary and does God grade on a curve if we try to live this way and fail? So where do we have or find confidence? This perfection sounds like a recipe for failure.

 

[Lamb]

How much perfect obedience or perfection is necessary and does God grade on a curve if we try to live this way and fail? So where do we have or find confidence? This perfection sounds like a recipe for failure.

Since only our triune God is perfect, maybe those pushing for perfection (especially in a thread entitled Jesus will save you if you....) should look to the Savior who covers us in HIS righteousness?

 

[Edward429451]

How much perfect obedience or perfection is necessary and does God grade on a curve if we try to live this way and fail? So where do we have or find confidence? This perfection sounds like a recipe for failure.

We spoke about that before! He said He doesn't expect us to be perfect in everything, but He wants us to try. Because it is the heart that He looks at and the intentions of the heart while we are within the task or whatever.

He almost has to grade us on the curve wouldn't you think?! I mean, look at man. We are the remedial class, so stupid and slow learning, a hard hearted, stiff necked people.

He touched on that with me once, but I don't remember what He said exactly. He does want perfect obedience. He said He wants all His Children to learn to hear His still small voice, and obey instantly, immediately. He said one time, many are called, few are chosen, and even fewer respond. So unless He grades us on a curve and watches our efforts and intentions, He might only be able to save 35 people on earth?!

And I think that that is true myself. Scripture speaks about how He is longsuffering towards us, and I remember countless times I have thanked Him and Praised Him because He is longsuffering towards me (us) in particular.

 

[Lamb]

We spoke about that before! He said He doesn't expect us to be perfect in everything, but He wants us to try. Because it is the heart that He looks at and the intentions of the heart while we are within the task or whatever.

He almost has to grade us on the curve wouldn't you think?! I mean, look at man. We are the remedial class, so stupid and slow learning, a hard hearted, stiff necked people.

He touched on that with me once, but I don't remember what He said exactly. He does want perfect obedience. He said He wants all His Children to learn to hear His still small voice, and obey instantly, immediately. He said one time, many are called, few are chosen, and even fewer respond. So unless He grades us on a curve and watches our efforts and intentions, He might only be able to save 35 people on earth?!

And I think that that is true myself. Scripture speaks about how He is longsuffering towards us, and I remember countless times I have thanked Him and Praised Him because He is longsuffering towards me (us) in particular.

Your post makes it sound like you won't be saved unless you try to be perfect? Where does that leave Jesus, the cross and forgvieness of sins?

 

[Edward429451]

Your post makes it sound like you won't be saved unless you try to be perfect? Where does that leave Jesus, the cross and forgvieness of sins?

I'm sorry, did I fail to post that preamble again. It's prolly a few pages back by now, but it went something like this...
Ok we all know and agree that Salvation is a free gift and has nothing to do with being perfect or Salvation"

That said, Maybe you missed a few posts of mine? Where I explained as best I could that our good works and giving to the poor and such is, (the garments of the saints) Doing good for all, helping them as much as you would hope someone would help you if you needed it, Be Patient with people. Giving to the poor and doing good deeds are not without an effect upon our rewards and station in life in Heaven when we get there.

You don't have to do any works. You can keep your money in your pocket, and you'll go to Heaven and receive Salvation. But will you have a Mansion in town on a very nice lot, or will you get a shack (in comparison) on the edge of town?

Remember the Parable? The Master gave three men some talents to go on while He is out of town. One got 5 talents, one got 2 tlents and one got 1 talent. I'm back! Look, here is your 5 talents and here is 5 more! Well done thou good and faithful servant!
Now you, here is your 2 talents, and here is 2 more! Well done! (not good and faithful!).Now you. Here is your 1 talent back...You are fired you Un-Profitable Servant!

So the idea is to be a Profitable servant for the Lord. Oh, I forgot, one guy got put over 10 cities and the ther over 5 cities. So they received a certain amount of Authority for being profitable servants.

Profitable Servant means....yes, do good works. Help people. Help them like you want to be helped. Love them in obedience to the Lord.

Do you get what I'm saying Lamb? Salvation is free, we still do works and try to do good. Not for Salvation. For Obedience.

So could you please stop trying to hang the works needed for salvation badge on me? That's not mine.

 

[BruceLeiter]

Interesting. We do know that God never changes, right?

So if God planned everything we will do, then...He planned for Adam & Eve to fall?
He planned for Jonah to run away from Nineveh instead of going there? If that is so, then where is our free will? Don't we have to make a decision? A choice?
So if a homosexual wants to join the church and be a member, and has not repented of being a homo, then go ahead and accept them in and, God will grant them repentance later when He wants to?

Some aspects of what you have said are true. But other parts suggest things that, are hard to swallow.

Can you give me an example of the Holy Spirit working through you to do whatever His will was at the time? What happened? Holy Spirit said to you, do this or that, and you agreed and did it? And then what came of it?

I think that part of my problem with your position is that, You have not personalized anything at all. You have the doctrine, and say God does this in us, God does that...and never a word about you in that situation.

@Edward429451, I think that the Bible says that God PERMITS or ALLOWS Adam and Eve's fall and Jonah's rebellion; he doesn't cause them to happen. Therefore, God is not responsible; people are.

If a practicing, unrepentant homosexual person wants to join my church, as with all people, he has to show evidence of faith and repentance to demonstrate that he is a true Christian. Of course, he should leave that sinful lifestyle, which would bring dishonor to Jesus if he joined without at least abstaining from such illicit sex.

Like Jonah, I "ran away" from God's call to be a pastor, but the Holy Spirit worked in me by using ten events to prepare me to make the jump to seminary with my dear wife and three children. He took care of us in some dramatic ways to prepare me for the ministry.

 

[jswauto]

THE PRAYER OF SALVATION (Romans 10:9–10)​

“Lord Jesus, I confess with my mouth that You are Lord. I believe in my heart that God raised You from the dead. Forgive my sins, make me new, and save me. I receive You now as my Lord and Savior. Amen.”

This prayer is built directly on the salvation formula Paul gives:

• Speak with your mouth → confession
• Believe in your heart → faith
• You are saved → promise

Paul doesn’t complicate it. He doesn’t add conditions. He doesn’t add theological systems.
He gives the simple gospel pathway.

KEY SCRIPTURES THAT REVEAL THE TRUTH OF SALVATION​

1. Romans 10:9–10 — The Core Salvation Formula​

“If you confess with your mouth… and believe in your heart… you will be saved.”

This is the clearest salvation mechanic in the New Testament. Confession + belief = salvation.

2. John 1:12 — Receiving Christ​

“To all who received Him… He gave the right to become children of God.”

Salvation is not forced. It is received.

3. John 3:16 — The Universal Invitation​

“Whoever believes in Him shall not perish but have eternal life.”

Not “the elect only.” Not “the predestined only.” Whoever believes.

4. Acts 2:21 — The Open Door​

“Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

Everyone. Not some. Not a select group. Not a predetermined subset.

5. Revelation 3:20 — Christ Knocks​

“I stand at the door and knock. If anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in.”

Christ knocks. You open. He enters.
That’s salvation.

6. Ephesians 2:8–9 — Grace, Not Performance​

“By grace you have been saved through faith… not by works.”

Salvation is:

• grace → God’s part
• faith → your response

No works. No merit. No earning.

7. Romans 5:8 — Love Before Change​

“While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.”

Christ didn’t wait for you to improve. He saved you as you were.

SUMMARY OF SALVATION​

Salvation is simple, direct, and rooted in the clear promise of Scripture: confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, and you will be saved. It is not earned, forced, complicated, or reserved for a select group — it is received by faith through grace. Anyone who calls on the name of the Lord is welcomed, forgiven, made new, and given the right to become a child of God. Salvation is the doorway into life with Christ: a once‑for‑all moment where we receive Him, trust Him, and are saved by His finished work. It is the gift that begins the journey.

AFTER SALVATION — WHAT TO DO NEXT​

After receiving Christ, the very next step is to grow in Him. Salvation is the beginning; discipleship is the journey. Scripture encourages every new believer to connect their life to three simple practices that build strength, clarity, and stability:
1. Find a Bible‑believing church. A healthy church family helps you learn, grow, worship, and walk with others who are following Jesus. You weren’t meant to walk the Christian life alone — God places believers in community so they can be encouraged, supported, and taught.
2. Pray daily. Prayer keeps your relationship with Jesus alive and personal. Talk to Him. Thank Him. Ask for guidance. Bring your struggles, your questions, your hopes. Prayer is how you stay close to the One who saved you.
3. Read the Word daily. The Bible is your spiritual food. It teaches you who God is, who you are, and how to walk in the new life He’s given you. Even a few verses a day will strengthen your faith and renew your mind.
These simple steps help you grow from salvation into maturity — from the moment you receive Christ into a life that reflects Him.
4. Praise the Lord. Give the Lord God Almighty your deepest heart fealt praise and worship often. He is worthy!

​

 

[jswauto]

THE PRAYER OF SANCTIFICATION, A DAILY PRACTICE​

The Prayer of Salvation isn’t just the doorway into the Christian life — it becomes the heartbeat of sanctification for the believer. Scripture teaches that salvation begins with a simple, powerful act:

“If you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.” (Romans 10:9–10)

That confession isn’t meant to be a one‑time event you leave behind. It becomes a lifelong rhythm of returning to Christ, re‑aligning your heart, and renewing your surrender.
Every time a believer prays:

• “Jesus, You are Lord,”
• “I believe You died and rose for me,”
• “Forgive me,”
• “Cleanse me,”
• “Come into my life anew,”

they are not “getting saved again.” They are calling the Lord anew into their life — refreshing intimacy, restoring clarity, repenting, and re‑centering their heart in grace.
This is sanctification.

WHY PRAYING IT OFTEN MATTERS​

Unrepentant sin doesn’t unsave a believer — but it hardens the heart, dulls the conscience, and clouds spiritual vision. Scripture warns:

“If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us.” (1 John 1:9)

Confession is not a punishment. It is spiritual cleansing.
It is the believer saying:

• “Lord, wash me again.”
• “Remove what’s grown cold in me.”
• “Restore what sin has dimmed.”
• “Renew my heart.”

This is why praying the salvation prayer often is powerful — it keeps the heart soft, the conscience clear, and the relationship alive.

KEY SCRIPTURES THAT SUPPORT DAILY RENEWAL​

1. Psalm 51:10 — Renewal​

“Create in me a clean heart, O God, and renew a right spirit within me.”

This is the Old Testament version of “Lord, come anew into my life.”

2. Luke 9:23 — Daily Surrender​

“If anyone would come after Me, let him deny himself daily and follow Me.”

Salvation is a moment. Sanctification is daily.

3. Revelation 3:20 — Invitation​

“I stand at the door and knock… if anyone opens, I will come in.”

He knocks daily. We open daily.

4. Romans 12:1 — Living Sacrifice​

“Present your bodies as a living sacrifice…”

Living sacrifices will be presented continually.

SUMMARY OF DAILY RENEWAL​

The Prayer of Salvation is not just how we begin — it’s how we continue.Confessing Jesus as Lord, believing in His resurrection, and calling Him anew into our lives keeps the heart clean and focused, the conscience clear, and the relationship vibrant.For the saved, it becomes the prayer of sanctification:a daily renewal, a daily cleansing, a daily surrender, and a daily invitation for Christ to reign.