Jesus will save you if you.... ???

[Edward429451]

What I need to do is repent and believe. If the church expects me to earn salvation by giving something or praying

What blows my mind is that so many people call themselves Christians and shout it loud that they are not in the Service of God. Like we weren't created to serve God and bring Him glory. Oh, that would be doing something and He said it's a free gift so I don't have to! Lol.

 

[Truth7t7]

Here is the perfect scripture to show that repentance comes from God in the form of a gift...He turns us!

2 Timothy 2:25 ... in meekness correcting them that oppose themselves; if peradventure God may give them repentance unto the knowledge of the truth,

"I Agree 100%" God Gives one to repentance, simple and very clear before our eyes, God is merciful, thank you Lord Jesus

2 Timothy 2:24-26KJV
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

 

[Lamb]

What blows my mind is that so many people call themselves Christians and shout it loud that they are not in the Service of God. Like we weren't created to serve God and bring Him glory. Oh, that would be doing something and He said it's a free gift so I don't have to! Lol.

So you believe we have to DO something for salvation? That's the point of THIS thread.

My salvation is dependent solely on the work of Christ Jesus, crucified for my sins. You keep saying that you still need to do something in order to get salvation.

Christians will serve God because they have salvation. Not in order to gain it.

 

[Edward429451]

So you believe we have to DO something for salvation? That's the point of THIS thread.

My salvation is dependent solely on the work of Christ Jesus, crucified for my sins. You keep saying that you still need to do something in order to get salvation.

Christians will serve God because they have salvation. Not in order to gain it.

I have told you a dozen times that Salvation has nothing to do with anything you do except repent to Lord God. Nothing else.

Show me where I said you need to do something other than repent to receive salvation?

Here's where you contradicted yourself. While this is a true statement here, in earlier posts you said no you never do anything for the Lord will do everything through you. Remember saying that?

 

[Edward429451]

"I Agree 100%" God Gives one to repentance, simple and very clear before our eyes, God is merciful, thank you Lord Jesus

2 Timothy 2:24-26KJV
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

So why does God tell us to Repent in scripture? I believe you have misunderstood that verse on which you hang your hat. If God gave everyone repentance then He wouldn't have to say repent. Make sense?

...God peradventure will give them repentance... right?
Which is to say, God will give them The Capacity for repentance.

How does God increase one's capacity for repentance? Through their conscience, speaking to their heart, putting in their mind enough understanding to make them question themselves, maybe I am doing the wrong thing? I know I should stop doing this sin that I have been doing...

so in that way, God gives them the capacity for repentance, but He does not Repent for them! What do you think, pick up the plow means?

If the camp which believes that Repentance is a gift, then ask yourself, does that mean I can continue in sin? Do I not need to stop living in fornication/adultery, drugs, drinking, or whatever your favorite sin is? Why repent, Jesus gave it to you for a gift? One day He will come and make you all perfect and take you to heaven...because you claim it to be so?

Wow Brothers & Sisters, Wow. Good luck with not repenting and turning away from your sins. I think that perhaps a name may apply to this camp of Christians? Unprofitable Servant? I see it as almost the same thing as getting a job. When you get a good job, you want to show up early, work late, whatever they need. How well would I be received into the new job if I asked for my first day to be a day off, paid. No, when they say be there at 7:30, I showed up at 7:10. That was normal for me. When you stop being better, you stop being good. I wanted to show up cleaner, earlier, better and sharp more so than the other guys, when I got a good job.

So now we have all joined the Kingdom of God, and it does have benefits, but there is much to be done in the service of the Lord and instead of being about your Fathers Business, you'd rather brag that you don't have to do anything, just collect benefits. Personally, I find that absurd. I can be holier tomorrow than I was today. I know Jesus will finish perfecting me one day, but I can do something. Obey! What can I possibly do on my own in the flesh to Obey God? Not much, I'm only a man. But! I am His Creation, am I to make Him proud or disappointed? I have to try, it is someing inside of me. So I told her, that she has to move out. She didn't like it, but I am obeying God and not her, so go.

God didn't tell her to move, I did.

How long can you go without sinning? Have you ever paid attention? It's not as hard as you think to not sin. To say, Well I can't do it so I wont make them move out and Jesus understands and will make me perfect in His timing...? Doesn't that strike you as an arrogant and selfish position towards God now?!

What do we pray? ...Your Kingdom come, Your will be done, ON EARTH as it is in Heaven. As above so below? Can't do it? Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak? That's a nice sounding cliche' ! I submit that that sounds like, Unprofitable servant, Lazy servant?

God does not repent for us, but he gifts us with the capacity to repent, so...there will be no excuse. I suggest doing a word study on every word that you highlighted in 2nd Timothy back to the original language, Greek. It might help you understand the truth.

Have a good day Brother.

 

[Lamb]

I have told you a dozen times that Salvation has nothing to do with anything you do except repent to Lord God. Nothing else.

Show me where I said you need to do something other than repent to receive salvation?

Here's where you contradicted yourself. While this is a true statement here, in earlier posts you said no you never do anything for the Lord will do everything through you. Remember saying that?

Please tell me then why you've said twice here in this thread that you have a part in your salvation?

And you're misquoting me, so get it right if you wish for me to continue discussing with you.

 

[BruceLeiter]

I think that forgiveness has to happen in two parts:

1. Unloading our anger and anxiety on God in persistent prayer, while seeking his peace, the way Paul calls us to do in Philippians 4:6-7:

Php 4:6 do not be anxious about anything, but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known to God.
Php 4:7 And the peace of God, which surpasses all understanding, will guard your hearts and your minds in Christ Jesus.

2. Accepting the fact that God will judge others who have hurt us at the final judgment and leaving it in his hands:

Mat 25:31 “When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne.
Mat 25:32 Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats.
Mat 25:33 And he will place the sheep on his right, but the goats on the left.
Mat 25:34 Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world....

Mat 25:41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels....

Mat 25:46 And these will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”

 

[Edward429451]

“I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes.” Ezekiel 36:26–27

We need to pray for repentance. But you may be asking, “Isn’t repentance something God tells us to do?” In other words: Is repentance something God commands, or is it something He gives?

Repentance is a command. God “commands all people everywhere to repent” (Acts 17:30). But repentance is also a gift. In Acts 11:18, we read that “to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance that leads to life.”

In 2 Timothy 2:25, Paul says that we must gently instruct those who oppose us in the hope that “God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth.” God grants repentance, so you can ask God to give you a contrite heart. You can ask Him to change your heart. You can cry out to Him “Lord, restore repentance!”

This is the promise of the gospel: God will give you a new heart (Ezek. 36:26–27). That’s why we can pray for God to restore repentance. In this prayer, you are asking God to change your stubborn heart. You are asking God, “Pour out your Spirit on me. Cause me to hate what You hate and love what You love. I can’t get there on my own.”

 

[Lamb]

“I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. And I will put my Spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes.” Ezekiel 36:26–27

We need to pray for repentance. But you may be asking, “Isn’t repentance something God tells us to do?” In other words: Is repentance something God commands, or is it something He gives?

Repentance is a command. God “commands all people everywhere to repent” (Acts 17:30). But repentance is also a gift. In Acts 11:18, we read that “to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance that leads to life.”

In 2 Timothy 2:25, Paul says that we must gently instruct those who oppose us in the hope that “God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth.” God grants repentance, so you can ask God to give you a contrite heart. You can ask Him to change your heart. You can cry out to Him “Lord, restore repentance!”

This is the promise of the gospel: God will give you a new heart (Ezek. 36:26–27). That’s why we can pray for God to restore repentance. In this prayer, you are asking God to change your stubborn heart. You are asking God, “Pour out your Spirit on me. Cause me to hate what You hate and love what You love. I can’t get there on my own.”

I agree that repentance is a gift...it's what God does within us...He repents us.

 

[Edward429451]

I agree that repentance is a gift...it's what God does within us...He repents us.

Hey come on, I thought we agreed to let this go. You promised not to bring this up here to me again.

You misunderstand that verse, that's all there is to it. Best read it again.

God does not repent for us! He gives us the capacity to repent on our own. He speaks to heart and spirit and gives us understanding.

You say you don't have to Repent! Wow Sister.
(Note to self, do not accept invites to Lutheran churches.)

 

[Truth7t7]

So why does God tell us to Repent in scripture? I believe you have misunderstood that verse on which you hang your hat. If God gave everyone repentance then He wouldn't have to say repent. Make sense?

...God peradventure will give them repentance... right?
Which is to say, God will give them The Capacity for repentance.

How does God increase one's capacity for repentance? Through their conscience, speaking to their heart, putting in their mind enough understanding to make them question themselves, maybe I am doing the wrong thing? I know I should stop doing this sin that I have been doing...

so in that way, God gives them the capacity for repentance, but He does not Repent for them! What do you think, pick up the plow means?

If the camp which believes that Repentance is a gift, then ask yourself, does that mean I can continue in sin? Do I not need to stop living in fornication/adultery, drugs, drinking, or whatever your favorite sin is? Why repent, Jesus gave it to you for a gift? One day He will come and make you all perfect and take you to heaven...because you claim it to be so?

Wow Brothers & Sisters, Wow. Good luck with not repenting and turning away from your sins. I think that perhaps a name may apply to this camp of Christians? Unprofitable Servant? I see it as almost the same thing as getting a job. When you get a good job, you want to show up early, work late, whatever they need. How well would I be received into the new job if I asked for my first day to be a day off, paid. No, when they say be there at 7:30, I showed up at 7:10. That was normal for me. When you stop being better, you stop being good. I wanted to show up cleaner, earlier, better and sharp more so than the other guys, when I got a good job.

So now we have all joined the Kingdom of God, and it does have benefits, but there is much to be done in the service of the Lord and instead of being about your Fathers Business, you'd rather brag that you don't have to do anything, just collect benefits. Personally, I find that absurd. I can be holier tomorrow than I was today. I know Jesus will finish perfecting me one day, but I can do something. Obey! What can I possibly do on my own in the flesh to Obey God? Not much, I'm only a man. But! I am His Creation, am I to make Him proud or disappointed? I have to try, it is someing inside of me. So I told her, that she has to move out. She didn't like it, but I am obeying God and not her, so go.

God didn't tell her to move, I did.

How long can you go without sinning? Have you ever paid attention? It's not as hard as you think to not sin. To say, Well I can't do it so I wont make them move out and Jesus understands and will make me perfect in His timing...? Doesn't that strike you as an arrogant and selfish position towards God now?!

What do we pray? ...Your Kingdom come, Your will be done, ON EARTH as it is in Heaven. As above so below? Can't do it? Spirit is willing but the flesh is weak? That's a nice sounding cliche' ! I submit that that sounds like, Unprofitable servant, Lazy servant?

God does not repent for us, but he gifts us with the capacity to repent, so...there will be no excuse. I suggest doing a word study on every word that you highlighted in 2nd Timothy back to the original language, Greek. It might help you understand the truth.

Have a good day Brother.

Romans 8:29-30KJV
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

2 Timothy 2:24-26KJV
24 And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle unto all men, apt to teach, patient,
25 In meekness instructing those that oppose themselves; if God peradventure will give them repentance to the acknowledging of the truth;
26 And that they may recover themselves out of the snare of the devil, who are taken captive by him at his will.

 

[Truth7t7]

I agree that repentance is a gift...it's what God does within us...He repents us.

Repents us/Calls us to repentance, same

 

[Lamb]

Hey come on, I thought we agreed to let this go. You promised not to bring this up here to me again.

You misunderstand that verse, that's all there is to it. Best read it again.

God does not repent for us! He gives us the capacity to repent on our own. He speaks to heart and spirit and gives us understanding.

You say you don't have to Repent! Wow Sister.
(Note to self, do not accept invites to Lutheran churches.)

The verses say that we are not alone in repentance.

And I do not say we don't have to repent. Please, I really wish you would respect me more instead of putting words into my mouth and making these false claims about what you think I believe. I'm very clear on my beliefs.

 

[Edward429451]

The verses say that we are not alone in repentance.

And I do not say we don't have to repent. Please, I really wish you would respect me more instead of putting words into my mouth and making these false claims about what you think I believe. I'm very clear on my beliefs.

Then speak more clearly what is in your heart. Then answer me a question if I ask it, without dodging it.

 

[Lamb]

Then speak more clearly what is in your heart. Then answer me a question if I ask it, without dodging it.

I've answered fully...especially in regards to the question of this thread...

We contribute nothing to our salvation; it's God's work to save us.

Justification is God's work completely.

We cooperate in sanctification, but it's God's working within us for that too.

 

[Edward429451]

We cooperate in sanctification, but it's God's working within us for that too.

Whoa! You admit that we participate! First time.

Will you tell me more about how we cooperate in our Sanctification?

What is it, that we do, to cooperate?

 

[Lamb]

Whoa! You admit that we participate! First time.

Will you tell me more about how we cooperate in our Sanctification?

What is it, that we do, to cooperate?

I admit it but not for Justification. Your posts have led me to believe that you believe we have to participate in some way in order to receive salvation from God. Sanctification in the sense I am using it, is not the same as Justification. In Justification we are declared Not Guilty by God...that means we have salvation. In sanctification, the Holy Spirit guides us into bearing fruit and doing the Good Works God has planned for us.

So you see, we have differences in beliefs. I say we do nothing for salvation (justification).

 

[Edward429451]

I admit it but not for Justification. Your posts have led me to believe that you believe we have to participate in some way in order to receive salvation from God. Sanctification in the sense I am using it, is not the same as Justification. In Justification we are declared Not Guilty by God...that means we have salvation. In sanctification, the Holy Spirit guides us into bearing fruit and doing the Good Works God has planned for us.

So you see, we have differences in beliefs. I say we do nothing for salvation (justification).

I think we have to ask ourselves the question, is it a good thing to separate Salvation from...walking with the Lord and being in the Service of God? A if it is two different subjects?!

Scripture says, build up your treasures in heaven. It also says, that some will be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven. So we can easily surmise rank is real in Heaven.

Don't you want to be promoted in God's Kingdom? I thought about it and I concluded (prayed) that, I do not want to be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven. I certainly don't expect to upseat Moses or Paul and I don't want to. Just not be least.

I can see that what we do on earth in service and obedience to the Lord will affect our standing in Heaven. Some will get more treasures, crowns, bigger mansions...but am I to have a shack on the edge of town (IN comparison)

I've heard multiple testimonies from people who had NDE's and got to visit heaven and n their recounting of it and the details they all thought that, their time was up and they are dead. And they experienced remorse and regret, that they didn't do more while they were alive. Now of course they were wrong about staying dead because they came back and gave the testimony! The first time I heard it it didn't stick much. But then I heard it again, regret they didn't do more...and I admit I took that to heart and thought, gee, I'm still alive! What extra can I do?

Who would rather have less in heaven than more? What is that? A lukewarm spirit? So it baffles me that you sound like you want to do less or do nothing? (You havent been clear about that).

There is 5 or is it 7 Crowns that scripture speaks of, those who do this get this crown, those who do that get that crown. I think it would be nice to have even one.

Shall I not build up my treasures in Heaven? My standing in the community that will be my home for eternity?

So Salvation is not the end where you go into God's rest and never do anything. No! It is the Beginning! The Beginning of your Relationship with the Lord! Your walk! So that is not the time to wait on God. He has been waiting on us. To stand up in the Valley of the Shadow of Death and Evil, and do a good turn for someone! No questions asked, here....Love them, even when the may hate you.

 

[Edward429451]

1 Peter 1:14-16
14 So you must live as God’s obedient children. Don’t slip back into your old ways of living to satisfy your own desires. You didn’t know any better then.
15 But now you must be holy in everything you do, just as God who chose you is holy.
16 For the Scriptures say, “You must be holy because I am holy..../NLT

 

[Lamb]

I think we have to ask ourselves the question, is it a good thing to separate Salvation from...walking with the Lord and being in the Service of God? A if it is two different subjects?!

Scripture says, build up your treasures in heaven. It also says, that some will be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven. So we can easily surmise rank is real in Heaven.

Don't you want to be promoted in God's Kingdom? I thought about it and I concluded (prayed) that, I do not want to be called the least in the Kingdom of Heaven. I certainly don't expect to upseat Moses or Paul and I don't want to. Just not be least.

I can see that what we do on earth in service and obedience to the Lord will affect our standing in Heaven. Some will get more treasures, crowns, bigger mansions...but am I to have a shack on the edge of town (IN comparison)

I've heard multiple testimonies from people who had NDE's and got to visit heaven and n their recounting of it and the details they all thought that, their time was up and they are dead. And they experienced remorse and regret, that they didn't do more while they were alive. Now of course they were wrong about staying dead because they came back and gave the testimony! The first time I heard it it didn't stick much. But then I heard it again, regret they didn't do more...and I admit I took that to heart and thought, gee, I'm still alive! What extra can I do?

Who would rather have less in heaven than more? What is that? A lukewarm spirit? So it baffles me that you sound like you want to do less or do nothing? (You havent been clear about that).

There is 5 or is it 7 Crowns that scripture speaks of, those who do this get this crown, those who do that get that crown. I think it would be nice to have even one.

Shall I not build up my treasures in Heaven? My standing in the community that will be my home for eternity?

So Salvation is not the end where you go into God's rest and never do anything. No! It is the Beginning! The Beginning of your Relationship with the Lord! Your walk! So that is not the time to wait on God. He has been waiting on us. To stand up in the Valley of the Shadow of Death and Evil, and do a good turn for someone! No questions asked, here....Love them, even when the may hate you.

The separation is because the topic of the thread is Jesus will save you if you...

Why keep inserting yourself back into the equation when Jesus is the one who saves us?

1 Peter 1:14-16
14 So you must live as God’s obedient children. Don’t slip back into your old ways of living to satisfy your own desires. You didn’t know any better then.
15 But now you must be holy in everything you do, just as God who chose you is holy.
16 For the Scriptures say, “You must be holy because I am holy..../NLT

You keep insisting about talking about the walk of the faithful (you know, those who are bound for eternal life)... So here are some verses showing that the Holy Spirit, who dwells within us is the one who is leading us to do what He has planned for us to do:

Ezekiel 36:27
And I will put My Spirit within you and bring it about that you walk in My statutes, and are careful and follow My ordinances.

Ephesians 1:13-14
...were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance ...


Isaiah 26:12
Lord, You will establish peace for us,since You have also performed for us all our works.

Hebrews 13:20-211
...equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

2 Peter 1:3
His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness,

Ephesians 2:10
For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

Isaiah 41:10
...for I am your God; I will strengthen you, I will help you, I will uphold you with my righteous right hand.