Have you all had enough of politics mixing into religion?

[MoreCoffee]

One is used to religion speaking about some matters in politics, but have you all had enough of politics intruding into religion?

 

[tango]

I'm heartily sick of seeing people who are very visible in church change totally as soon as their hit social media, and start posting endless political bile. I completely lost respect for a few people in my former church because of that.

If you want to share who you're voting for, go ahead. If you want to explain why this policy will work or that policy won't work, go ahead. If you want to say that people who vote for a particular candidate are idiots or worse, maybe stop and think first.

 

[Lamb]

I think that as Christians, we can see how politics affect our Christian walk. It's difficult to separate ourselves from the world entirely, when the world affects us.

 

[tango]

I think that as Christians, we can see how politics affect our Christian walk. It's difficult to separate ourselves from the world entirely, when the world affects us.

I don't think we should separate ourselves from the world entirely - we have to be in the world.

I think a lot comes down to how we interpret some basic calls. I think of the parable of the Good Samaritan and what the Samaritan did. He saw the wounded man in need, and met the needs. He didn't write to his congressman demanding more government programs to help victims of street violence, he didn't crow about how the rich should pay more taxes so there could be more police on the streets, he didn't complain about the local oligarch owning six golden chariots while this guy suffered, he just got busy and met the need there and then.

If the church acts on the changes we say we want it would be a lot more convincing than if we act as if we're nothing more than another pressure group expecting someone else do the work.

 

[Lanman87]

I'm tired of Politicians claiming to be religious in order to pander for votes.

I'm tired of Christians putting winning in politics ahead of making disciples and proclaiming the good news.

Personally, I find politics fascinating. The strategies of campaigning and reason people vote why they why is interesting. However, I don't really worry about the outcome. God is in control and will give us the leaders we either need or deserve.

 

[MoreCoffee]

What I am most concerned about is the extent to which Christians have confused Politics with Church. The extent to which some believe that one cannot be a Christian unless one agrees to voting for (or against) a specified party.

 

[The Jason]

A big problem is the democrats are pushing weird stuff like "gender affirmation" and it conflicts too strongly with conservative Christian views so a conflict is inevitable.

 

[Lamb]

What I am most concerned about is the extent to which Christians have confused Politics with Church. The extent to which some believe that one cannot be a Christian unless one agrees to voting for (or against) a specified party.

Since Roman Catholics are supposed to be against abortion, it would seem that they would think that voting Democrat goes against their Christian beliefs?

 

[tango]

Since Roman Catholics are supposed to be against abortion, it would seem that they would think that voting Democrat goes against their Christian beliefs?

Unless there's some other issue that any individual Catholic considers more important than abortion?

Certainly for some people abortion is the biggest issue for them as far as casting a vote is concerned. For others it's the economy, or some other matter. I'm not sure it's helpful to present a single issue as if a very large and presumably diverse group that has one common attribute must unite around that issue.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Since Roman Catholics are supposed to be against abortion, it would seem that they would think that voting Democrat goes against their Christian beliefs?

A vote for a role that directly controls abortions will elevate the significance of abortion for that vote. A vote for a role that does not control abortions will lower the significance of abortion for that vote. For example, voting for a president of the USA has no direct control over abortion. A president does not make laws. Making laws belongs to the congress. Enforcing laws is a role for the executive. Deciding the meaning of laws is a role for the Judiciary.

The Catholic Church teaches that abortion is an intrinsic evil and must be opposed. However, when it comes to voting, the Church does not mandate that Catholics must vote solely based on a candidate's stance on abortion. Instead, Catholics are encouraged to consider a range of moral issues and the overall common good when making their voting decisions [Catholics, Voting and Abortion: Time to Correct the Record , A Catholic Approach to Voting in the 2024 Election | Michigan Catholic Conference].

The Church's teaching emphasizes the importance of protecting human life from conception, but it also acknowledges that voters must weigh other significant issues, such as social justice, healthcare, and the environment [Catholics, Voting and Abortion: Time to Correct the Record , A Catholic Approach to Voting in the 2024 Election | Michigan Catholic Conference].. This means that while abortion is a critical issue, it is not the only factor that should guide a Catholic's vote [Catholics, Voting and Abortion: Time to Correct the Record , A Catholic Approach to Voting in the 2024 Election | Michigan Catholic Conference].

 

[MoreCoffee]

Unless there's some other issue that any individual Catholic considers more important than abortion?

Certainly for some people abortion is the biggest issue for them as far as casting a vote is concerned. For others it's the economy, or some other matter. I'm not sure it's helpful to present a single issue as if a very large and presumably diverse group that has one common attribute must unite around that issue.

I like the appreciation of the complex interplay between moral issues that your post presents.

 

[The Jason]

Despite the culture war that democrats have forced on everyone, Trump wasn't the answer. I mean, the Republicans might as well put in a serial killer as the candidate, honestly.

 

[Faith]

Since Roman Catholics are supposed to be against abortion, it would seem that they would think that voting Democrat goes against their Christian beliefs?

I’m Catholic and voted for Harris. I’m against abortion but had a huge problem with Trump which I felt more strongly than the abortion issue.

 

[MoreCoffee]

I’m Catholic and voted for Harris. I’m against abortion but had a huge problem with Trump which I felt more strongly than the abortion issue.

USA politics looks very divisive and tribal from Australia but maybe it looks peaceful and coherent or something else from within the USA, as for voting for Kamala, it seemed like it might be the lesser of the evils available if you want to vote, not voting is also an option.

 

[tango]

USA politics looks very divisive and tribal from Australia but maybe it looks peaceful and coherent or something else from within the USA, as for voting for Kamala, it seemed like it might be the lesser of the evils available if you want to vote, not voting is also an option.

A lot would depend on what's important to you.

If Kamala couldn't name a single thing she'd have done differently to Biden it's hard to take any claims that a Harris administration would be any different from a Biden administration seriously. So if you want another four years of quasi-Biden then Kamala is your candidate. If you want something else then Trump is your candidate. Whether or not you care for Harris or Trump as individuals, you had a good idea of what you'll get if they were victorious in the election.

As it turned out a majority of the voters didn't want a repeat of the last four years.

 

[MoreCoffee]

A lot would depend on what's important to you.

If Kamala couldn't name a single thing she'd have done differently to Biden it's hard to take any claims that a Harris administration would be any different from a Biden administration seriously. So if you want another four years of quasi-Biden then Kamala is your candidate. If you want something else then Trump is your candidate. Whether or not you care for Harris or Trump as individuals, you had a good idea of what you'll get if they were victorious in the election.

As it turned out a majority of the voters didn't want a repeat of the last four years.

I wonder if the USA is in for a rollercoaster ride politically speaking.

 

[MoreCoffee]

A big problem is the democrats are pushing weird stuff like "gender affirmation" and it conflicts too strongly with conservative Christian views so a conflict is inevitable.

I agree that what you've noted is a fault in the Democratic Party but what has it to do with being a Christian?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Despite the culture war that democrats have forced on everyone, Trump wasn't the answer. I mean, the Republicans might as well put in a serial killer as the candidate, honestly.

I agree with your sentiment but not really with the expressions you chose to express it.

The Democratic Party often becomes deeply involved in appealing to minority groups in an effort to build a coalition that constitutes a majority of voters. This approach may not be ideal. It would be more effective to outline their goals for improving the United States and enhancing the quality of life for its residents and citizens. If their objectives are commendable, the Democratic Party could be successful.

For several years, the Republican Party has been influenced by Donald Trump's messaging and public persona. His personal morals and conduct have not been significant enough to deter voters from supporting him and the party. However, the reasoning and ideals of those who voted for Donald Trump and the Republican Party are far more complex; they should not be dismissed as foolish, immoral, or demonic, as some extreme claims on social media suggest.

What should a Christian do? I believe there are three options:

• Choose not to vote, as voting may endorse someone or something that no Christian can support; allow the world to follow its own course under God's sovereign direction without engaging in the secular approach to governance.
• Vote. Cast your vote in line with your moral convictions, always remembering that your choices reflect whom you serve and why.
• Vote. Make your decision striving to understand the will of Christ and be willing to repent if it turns out to be incorrect, aiming to make a better choice in the future.

Or throw your hands up in horror and run away!

 

[tango]

I wonder if the USA is in for a rollercoaster ride politically speaking.

I think whoever won that would be the case. People talk as if the Harris ticket would lead to a nice easy ride with no nasty bumps in the road but I think the Democrats are so obsessed with minority groups and throwing money at everything in sight that they would be economically disastrous.

That's not to say I think Trump will be economically glorious, I think he has the potential to be disastrous, but I think he also has the potential to generate the economic growth we need.

 

[tango]

I agree with your sentiment but not really with the expressions you chose to express it.

The Democratic Party often becomes deeply involved in appealing to minority groups in an effort to build a coalition that constitutes a majority of voters. This approach may not be ideal. It would be more effective to outline their goals for improving the United States and enhancing the quality of life for its residents and citizens. If their objectives are commendable, the Democratic Party could be successful.

For several years, the Republican Party has been influenced by Donald Trump's messaging and public persona. His personal morals and conduct have not been significant enough to deter voters from supporting him and the party. However, the reasoning and ideals of those who voted for Donald Trump and the Republican Party are far more complex; they should not be dismissed as foolish, immoral, or demonic, as some extreme claims on social media suggest.

What should a Christian do? I believe there are three options:

• Choose not to vote, as voting may endorse someone or something that no Christian can support; allow the world to follow its own course under God's sovereign direction without engaging in the secular approach to governance.
• Vote. Cast your vote in line with your moral convictions, always remembering that your choices reflect whom you serve and why.
• Vote. Make your decision striving to understand the will of Christ and be willing to repent if it turns out to be incorrect, aiming to make a better choice in the future.

Or throw your hands up in horror and run away!

I think a key thing regarding what a Christian should do is to remember a few things:

1. We're electing a president, not a pastor.

2. Voting for Candidate A over Candidate B doesn't mean we approve of every single thing that A says or does, merely that we think A will do a better job than B. Whether we're voting for what we see as the greater good, the lesser evil, or good over evil, a vote is simply an assessment of relative value rather than absolute value. If I think A is the second-worst possible candidate for the office but that B is the absolute worst possible candidate, then I can still vote for A even if only to keep the even worse B out of office.

3. Someone who votes for the other candidate has probably gone through some form of reasoning along the lines of point (2), and merely come out with a different assessment of relative value. It doesn't help anyone to insist that a Christian couldn't possibly vote for B because Christians, like other groups, come in a variety of shapes and sizes and have different priorities.