Has Christ established His Kingdom ?

[brightfame52]

Does Jesus have a a established Kingdom where He reigns as King ? Listen to Jesus own words Jn 18:36

Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence. Jesus is speaking present tense here, and He is saying He possesses a Kingdom, its His, but its not of this world. So if He has a Kingdom, we suppose He is a King !

What about Col 1:13

13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Could this be Christs Kingdom He is referring to in Jn 18:36 ? Is this His established Kingdom ? Of course it is. Should we look for another ? I dont believe so, but there will be a visible manifestation of His Present Kingdom at His Second Coming 1 Tim 4:1

I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom

 

[Nazareth]

Hoping this is intelligible.

Being I believe Jesus was whom he said he was, God, I believe all existence is his kingdom being he is sovereign.

''Thy kingdom come on Earth as it is in heaven....''

 

[atpollard]

Ephesians 2:11-22 [NASB95]​

​

Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called "Uncircumcision" by the so-called "Circumcision," [which is] performed in the flesh by human hands-- [remember] that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who formerly were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. For He Himself is our peace, who made both [groups into] one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, [which is] the Law of commandments [contained] in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, [thus] establishing peace, and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity. AND HE CAME AND PREACHED PEACE TO YOU WHO WERE FAR AWAY, AND PEACE TO THOSE WHO WERE NEAR; for through Him we both have our access in one Spirit to the Father. So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints, and are of God's household, having been built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, Christ Jesus Himself being the corner [stone,] in whom the whole building, being fitted together, is growing into a holy temple in the Lord, in whom you also are being built together into a dwelling of God in the Spirit.​

​

The Kingdom exists here and now … we are already citizens and the living temple is already visible “tabernacling” on enemy shores … a beacon of light proclaiming Christ in a dark world.

• God has always been Sovereign.
• Christ landed on these shores and planted a flag that no man or spirit can move.
• We, the Children of God, rally around HIS flag creating tiny outposts of His Kingdom of Light.
• One Day, Christ will return and all of creation will be returned to His light as He drives all darkness away.

The Kingdom of God … already and not yet.

 

[Lees]

God is over all, and all is part of His Kingdom. Even Hades and the Lake of Fire are part of His Kingdom.

So, what does Jesus mean when He said, "Thy Kingdom come"? (Matt. 6:10)

Lees

 

[Lees]

God is over all, and all is part of His Kingdom. Even Hades and the Lake of Fire are part of His Kingdom.

So, what does Jesus mean when He said, "Thy Kingdom come"? (Matt. 6:10)

Lees

I would say first of all, that it means at that time, the Kingdom had not yet come. Even though Jesus, the King, was there. Remember it is Jesus who said it in (Matt. 6:10).

Consider (Ps. 103:19) "The LORD hath prepared his throne in the heavens; and his kingdom ruleth over all."

Contrasted with (Is. 24:23) "Then the moon shall be confounded, and the sun ashamed, when the LORD of hosts shall reign in mount Zion, and in Jerusalem, and before his ancients gloriously."

In one, God's kingdom is over all His creation and He rules. (Ps. 103:19)

In the other, God's reign and Kingdom is yet future. (Is 24:23)

These types of contrast with the Kingdom are found throughout Scripture.

Here are two more.

(Ps. 29:10) "The LORD sitteth upon the flood; yea, the LORD sitteth King for ever." God is already ruling and shall rule forever.

(Zech. 14:9) "And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one." God's rule is yet future.

Both are certainly true. They are stated in Scripture. And Scripture must be able to give an answer.

Lees

 

[SetFree]

Does Jesus have a a established Kingdom where He reigns as King ? Listen to Jesus own words Jn 18:36

Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence. Jesus is speaking present tense here, and He is saying He possesses a Kingdom, its His, but its not of this world. So if He has a Kingdom, we suppose He is a King !

What about Col 1:13

13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:

Could this be Christs Kingdom He is referring to in Jn 18:36 ? Is this His established Kingdom ? Of course it is. Should we look for another ? I dont believe so, but there will be a visible manifestation of His Present Kingdom at His Second Coming 1 Tim 4:1

I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom

It's important to first distinguish the difference between 'worlds', and dimensions of existence in God's Word. When Jesus said His kingdom is not of this world, He means not of this 'present' world time. And because there are other Scriptures that point to an existing kingdom already, it is pointing to God's kingdom that is in Heaven right now (like Galatians 4:26).

What Lord Jesus established here on earth at His 1st coming was His spiritual kingdom through His many-membered Church through The Spirit. When He returns in the near future, then He will establish His de facto physical kingdom over all nations and peoples, and reign over His enemies, and then deliver up the Kingdom to The Father in final.

 

[Lees]

It's important to first distinguish the difference between 'worlds', and dimensions of existence in God's Word. When Jesus said His kingdom is not of this world, He means not of this 'present' world time. And because there are other Scriptures that point to an existing kingdom already, it is pointing to God's kingdom that is in Heaven right now (like Galatians 4:26).

What Lord Jesus established here on earth at His 1st coming was His spiritual kingdom through His many-membered Church through The Spirit. When He returns in the near future, then He will establish His de facto physical kingdom over all nations and peoples, and reign over His enemies, and then deliver up the Kingdom to The Father in final.

You speak as if the Kingdom of God did not begin in man's history until the time of Jesus.

I disagree with your definiton of 'world' as relating to time. It speaks to the present existing world order which is under the rule of Satan. (John 12:31) (John 14:30) (John 16:11) It existed in Jesus day and exists in our day.

In other words, Jesus is saying His kingdom is from God, not Satan. It's Source is God not Satan. Jesus's Kingdom is not from Satans area of authority, the present world system, it is from God.

The Kingdom of God upon the earth, and delegated to man to rule over, has it's origin in (Gen. 1:28-31) "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth......"

Lees

 

[SetFree]

You speak as if the Kingdom of God did not begin in man's history until the time of Jesus.

I disagree with your definiton of 'world' as relating to time. It speaks to the present existing world order which is under the rule of Satan. (John 12:31) (John 14:30) (John 16:11) It existed in Jesus day and exists in our day.

In other words, Jesus is saying His kingdom is from God, not Satan. It's Source is God not Satan. Jesus's Kingdom is not from Satans area of authority, the present world system, it is from God.

The Kingdom of God upon the earth, and delegated to man to rule over, has it's origin in (Gen. 2:28-31) "And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth......"

Lees

You might want to read what I said again, instead of having pre-conceived notions of what you think... I wrote.

When Jesus said His Kingdom is not of 'this'... world, that is what He meant, it is not of this present world time, and per 2 Peter 3, there is such an idea as a world earth age period, for Peter revealed 3 of them...

1 - "the world that then was"
2 - "the heavens and the earth, which are now"
3 - "new heavens and a new earth"

Even Lord Jesus made a distinction between this present world, and the "world to come"...

Matt 12:32
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
KJV

So if you are thinking that in that "world to come" it does not involve the earth, a cleansed earth, but instead that future world means living up in the clouds in outer space somewhere, then you have left The Word of God.

 

[brightfame52]

It's important to first distinguish the difference between 'worlds', and dimensions of existence in God's Word. When Jesus said His kingdom is not of this world, He means not of this 'present' world time. And because there are other Scriptures that point to an existing kingdom already, it is pointing to God's kingdom that is in Heaven right now (like Galatians 4:26).

What Lord Jesus established here on earth at His 1st coming was His spiritual kingdom through His many-membered Church through The Spirit. When He returns in the near future, then He will establish His de facto physical kingdom over all nations and peoples, and reign over His enemies, and then deliver up the Kingdom to The Father in final.

Sounds interesting, so you believe that a rapture will occur at His second coming, the living saints will meet Him in the clouds and proceed to the earth and begin the affairs of eternity like Judgment and finally go into eternity forever serving Jesus Christ ?

 

[SetFree]

Sounds interesting, so you believe that a rapture will occur at His second coming, the living saints will meet Him in the clouds and proceed to the earth and begin the affairs of eternity like Judgment and finally go into eternity forever serving Jesus Christ ?

Well, I believe what is written in God's Word firstly. What is written about that?

In Matthew 24:29-31 Lord Jesus showed His coming to gather His Church will be immediately after the tribulation, and that was where Apostle Paul was pulling from with 1 Thessalonians 4 about being "caught up" to Him at that future event.

Zechariah 14 reveals Jesus returns at the end of the tribulation, or to end the trib, and that is on the "day of the Lord", the final day of this present world. That chapter shows His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, and a great valley will be formed there east of Jerusalem, and... that He brings all His faithful saints there with Him.

That has to mean on the day of His future return, He gathers His faithful elect along with the asleep saints Paul said He will bring with Him, and all go to the Mount of Olives on earth, east of Jerusalem. That is where He with His elect will begin His "thousand years" reign, which that Zechariah 14 chapter also includes some markers of that future reign over the wicked also.

One of the main Biblical ideas Paul taught about that day is the "change" that's to happen on the "last trump" per 1 Corinthians 15. That will happen for all... peoples still alive on earth on that day. Isaiah 25 is where Paul was pulling from about death being swallowed up in victory on that day. Zechariah 14:16-17 reveals the leftovers of those who came up against Jerusalem will still be there, and made to come worship The KING from year to year, and keep the feast of tabernacles. So these points mean the "thousand years" reign of Revelation 20 will be literal. Then after that 1,000, Satan will be loosed one final time to tempt the unsaved nations. Only then will come God's Great White Throne Judgment and the casting of Satan, the wicked, hell, and death, into the "lake of fire".

 

[SetFree]

God is over all, and all is part of His Kingdom. Even Hades and the Lake of Fire are part of His Kingdom.

So, what does Jesus mean when He said, "Thy Kingdom come"? (Matt. 6:10)

Lees

It means there will be a time in the future, at His return to this earth, that He will reign as KING of kings, and LORD of lords, over ALL nations on earth. In that future time there will be one LORD, and He shall be king over all the earth.

We do not... see that happening yet today on this earth. But it is coming. Only Christ's spiritual Kingdom is manifest on earth today. His literal Kingdom to come is not yet.

And what is disturbing are those who try... to confuse this issue about Christ's future LITERAL Kingdom to come on this earth at His future return. Some deceived, like the 'Kingdom Now' folks who think Christ's literal... Kingdom is already here today, think it means we Christians are to help create it here, literally upon this present earth, before Lord Jesus can return. That is a wild and crazy idea that is nowhere written in God's Word.

 

[brightfame52]

setfree

It means there will be a time in the future, at His return to this earth, that He will reign as KING of kings, and LORD of lords, over ALL nations on earth. In that future time there will be one LORD, and He shall be king over all the earth.

I can see that since Jesus Christ is also God Almighty

We do not... see that happening yet today on this earth. But it is coming.

Agreed according to 2 Tim 4:1

I charge thee therefore before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, who shall judge the quick and the dead at his appearing and his kingdom;

Only Christ's spiritual Kingdom is manifest on earth today. His literal Kingdom to come is not yet.

Agreed

And what is disturbing are those who try... to confuse this issue about Christ's future LITERAL Kingdom to come on this earth at His future return. Some deceived, like the 'Kingdom Now' folks who think Christ's literal... Kingdom is already here today, think it means we Christians are to help create it here, literally upon this present earth, before Lord Jesus can return. That is a wild and crazy idea that is nowhere written in God's Word.

Yes those are post millianal and premillennial I believe.

 

[brightfame52]

set free

Well, I believe what is written in God's Word firstly. What is written about that?

lol, everyone says that my friend

In Matthew 24:29-31 Lord Jesus showed His coming to gather His Church will be immediately after the tribulation, and that was where Apostle Paul was pulling from with 1 Thessalonians 4 about being "caught up" to Him at that future event.

Agreed, notice the trumpet even in both of those references. Do you the voice of the arch angel is Jesus Christ ?

Zechariah 14 reveals Jesus returns at the end of the tribulation, or to end the trib, and that is on the "day of the Lord", the final day of this present world. That chapter shows His feet will touch down upon the Mount of Olives, and a great valley will be formed there east of Jerusalem, and... that He brings all His faithful saints there with Him.

That has to mean on the day of His future return, He gathers His faithful elect along with the asleep saints Paul said He will bring with Him, and all go to the Mount of Olives on earth, east of Jerusalem. That is where He with His elect will begin His "thousand years" reign, which that Zechariah 14 chapter also includes some markers of that future reign over the wicked also.

I disagree with the 1000yr reign being after the tribulation, When Christ comes the second time His reign will be forever, not only a thousand years. Besides Hes reigning now for a 1000 yrs, meaning a very long time, since He ascended into heaven.

One of the main Biblical ideas Paul taught about that day is the "change" that's to happen on the "last trump" per 1 Corinthians 15. That will happen for all... peoples still alive on earth on that day. Isaiah 25 is where Paul was pulling from about death being swallowed up in victory on that day. Zechariah 14:16-17 reveals the leftovers of those who came up against Jerusalem will still be there, and made to come worship The KING from year to year, and keep the feast of tabernacles. So these points mean the "thousand years" reign of Revelation 20 will be literal. Then after that 1,000, Satan will be loosed one final time to tempt the unsaved nations. Only then will come God's Great White Throne Judgment and the casting of Satan, the wicked, hell, and death, into the "lake of fire".

I believe satan has been loosed and the nations deceived, and we are at the end of the 1000 yr reign, and the 2nd coming is imminent !

 

[SetFree]

Agreed, notice the trumpet even in both of those references. Do you the voice of the arch angel is Jesus Christ ?

[/QUOTE]
Yes. John 5:28-29 gives another example.

I disagree with the 1000yr reign being after the tribulation, When Christ comes the second time His reign will be forever, not only a thousand years. Besides Hes reigning now for a 1000 yrs, meaning a very long time, since He ascended into heaven.

Your choice. I cannot disagree with what is written in Revelation 20 about Christ's future "thousand years" reign with His elect. Are you aware of the end of Isaiah 24 which shows the kings of this world will be locked in the pit prison, and then after many days will be visited? That's a direct pointer to the event of Revelation 20 when Satan is locked in his pit prison for that future "thousand years" period also.

I believe satan has been loosed and the nations deceived, and we are at the end of the 1000 yr reign, and the 2nd coming is imminent !

I do not believe Satan has ever been 'bound' yet for this present world, not even since he first rebelled against God, which I believe his original rebellion happened in the world prior to this present world. Peter said in 1 Peter 5:8 that Satan is still walking about seeking whom he may devour. He won't be 'bound' until Lord Jesus returns in our near future, that is what the Scriptures declare (Rev.20).

The idea that the 1,000 years of Rev.20 has already started with Christ's death and resurrection, actually is a dangerous doctrine. Some Churches today are being deceived as they are told that since Lord Jesus came and died upon the cross, that it's up to us to convert the whole world to Jesus, and that His Kingdom is literally being established now, during this present world, without His return.

What are those really pointing to with those ideas? They are pointing to Satan's New World Order. That is what is being established today, and some Christian Churches are on board with it, thinking today Christ's Kingdom is already here. Afterall, to believe the 1,000 years events of Revelation 20 are for a time prior... to our Lord Jesus' 2nd coming, that is what it means. This is about the doctrine of men called Amillennialism, a 2nd century A.D. doctrine that never was a doctrine of the 1st century Church.

 

[brightfame52]

setfree

I do not believe Satan has ever been 'bound' yet for this present world, n

He was bound by the Cross when it was time in the purpose of God to begin His saving program for the Gentiles, prior to that the nations were under satanic deception Acts 14:16

16 Who in times past suffered all nations to walk in their own ways.

But at the end of the age, the 1000yrs he will be loosed to deceive the nations again, widespread deception Rev 20:8


And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog, and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.

At the beginning of the 1000 he was bound Rev 20:3

And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

That was for the outcalling of the gentiles . When the full number of the gentiles be brought in, satan is loosed for a season , which ends with the second coming.

See now, the whole world is deceived, except those whose names are written in the lambs book of life.

 

[Lees]

You might want to read what I said again, instead of having pre-conceived notions of what you think... I wrote.

When Jesus said His Kingdom is not of 'this'... world, that is what He meant, it is not of this present world time, and per 2 Peter 3, there is such an idea as a world earth age period, for Peter revealed 3 of them...

1 - "the world that then was"
2 - "the heavens and the earth, which are now"
3 - "new heavens and a new earth"

Even Lord Jesus made a distinction between this present world, and the "world to come"...

Matt 12:32
32 And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Ghost, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.
KJV

So if you are thinking that in that "world to come" it does not involve the earth, a cleansed earth, but instead that future world means living up in the clouds in outer space somewhere, then you have left The Word of God.

The word 'world' in (Matt. 12:32) speaks to an 'age'. Not the world order presently under Satans authority.

Lees

 

[Lees]

It means there will be a time in the future, at His return to this earth, that He will reign as KING of kings, and LORD of lords, over ALL nations on earth. In that future time there will be one LORD, and He shall be king over all the earth.

We do not... see that happening yet today on this earth. But it is coming. Only Christ's spiritual Kingdom is manifest on earth today. His literal Kingdom to come is not yet.

And what is disturbing are those who try... to confuse this issue about Christ's future LITERAL Kingdom to come on this earth at His future return. Some deceived, like the 'Kingdom Now' folks who think Christ's literal... Kingdom is already here today, think it means we Christians are to help create it here, literally upon this present earth, before Lord Jesus can return. That is a wild and crazy idea that is nowhere written in God's Word.

Again, you speak as if the Kingdom of God did not begin in mans history until the time of Jesus.

Again, (Gen. 1:28-31) is the origin of God's Kingdom on earth with man being the priest or mediator of it.

Lees

 

[SetFree]

The word 'world' in (Matt. 12:32) speaks to an 'age'. Not the world order presently under Satans authority.

Lees

Greek 'aion' implies the 'world', which is why translators used the word "world" in Bible translation. It does not change Christ's meaning, which is about the 'world' earth age after this present one. So arguing over the meaning of 'aion' is like straining at a gnat.

 

[SetFree]

Again, you speak as if the Kingdom of God did not begin in mans history until the time of Jesus.

Again, (Gen. 1:28-31) is the origin of God's Kingdom on earth with man being the priest or mediator of it.

Lees

No, actually I do not, men's traditions is where those ideas come from. As far as I'm concerned, God's Kingdom has been everlasting, existing even before... this present world earth AGE.

 

[Lees]

No, actually I do not, men's traditions is where those ideas come from. As far as I'm concerned, God's Kingdom has been everlasting, existing even before... this present world earth AGE.

Pay attention.

"Thy Kingdom come" (Matt.6:10)

"in mans history"

"the Kingdom on earth with man being the priest or mediator of it"

You speak as if the Kingdom Jesus spoke of did not begin until His day. And, (Gen 1:28-31) is not tradition. It is at that time that God gave man His Kingdom to mediate His rule over on the earth.

Lees