Why does the book of Revelation say that you can anoint your eyes with medicine to cure blindness?

[NathanH83]

In 1 Peter 4:8 the word “charity” in the KJV is “agape” in the Greek.
Do you have a clue what “agape” means and is that “giving money to the poor”? (charity/alms)
That will explain 1 Peter 4:8 (or you could just read more modern English in any translation less than 150 years old).

[1 Peter 4:8 NKJV] And above all things have fervent love for one another, for "love will cover a multitude of sins."

(This topic is not worth effort, but defending the Word of God from heretical misuse is.)

“And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. Use hospitality one to another without grudging. As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.”
-1 Peter 4:8-10

Bible Gateway passage: 1 Peter 4:8-10 - Authorized (King James) Version

And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. Use hospitality one to another without grudging. As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.

www.biblegateway.com

Notice the context. Peter is talking about hospitality and giving of gifts. Yes, he’s taking about charity.

 

[atpollard]

“And above all things have fervent charity among yourselves: for charity shall cover the multitude of sins. Use hospitality one to another without grudging. As every man hath received the gift, even so minister the same one to another, as good stewards of the manifold grace of God.”
-1 Peter 4:8-10

Notice the context. Peter is talking about hospitality and giving of gifts. Yes, he’s taking about charity.

Congratulations … you have graduated to full fledged HERETIC.

 

[Andrew]

Congratulations … you have graduated to full fledged HERETIC.

Post 163.

Tobit is no different than the others.. even if you believe it's a garbage book, at least be honest about the books understanding of what almsgiving meant in the OT

 

[atpollard]

Post 163.

Tobit is no different than the others.. even if you believe it's a garbage book, at least be honest about the books understanding of what almsgiving meant in the OT

The comment has nothing to do with Tobit … in post #181 he is teaching lies about what Peter wrote: “agape” is not “alms-giving”. That is a deliberate misuse of scripture to teach the buying of forgiveness. That is the action of a HERETIC.

He joins the ranks of Jehovah’s Witnesses and Mormons in the mishandling of scripture.

 

[Andrew]

The comment has nothing to do with Tobit … in post #181 he is teaching lies about what Peter wrote: “agape” is not “alms-giving”. That is a deliberate misuse of scripture to teach the buying of forgiveness. That is the action of a HERETIC.

He joins the ranks of Jehovah’s Witnesses and Mormons in the mishandling of scripture.

The selfless act of dispensing mercy and pity toward the less fortunate is an act of Love and honor toward the LORD Himself and is by virtue the full understanding of the two most important commands by Christ Jesus Lord and Savior.

If giving to the needy is heresy than YOU sir have rejected Christ completely

The disciples sold all of there belongings and gave their earnings to the poor.. are YOU willing to do that @atpollard?

Exactly.

Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth: That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

Whats the reward atpollard?

 

[NathanH83]

Congratulations … you have graduated to full fledged HERETIC.

Me? I’m just quoting Peter.
Huh?

 

[atpollard]

The selfless act of dispensing mercy and pity toward the less fortunate is an act of Love and honor toward the LORD Himself and is by virtue the full understanding of the two most important commands by Christ Jesus Lord and Savior.

If giving to the needy is heresy than YOU sir have rejected Christ completely

The disciples sold all of there belongings and gave their earnings to the poor.. are YOU willing to do that @atpollard?

Exactly.

Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.
Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth: That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

Whats the reward atpollard?

Clap, clap, clap.
Beautiful irrelevant speech.

Now as a Moderator, why don’t you explain the correct meaning of 1 Peter 4 to your errant brother (NathanH83) that is redefining “agape” as giving money so our sins will be forgiven … (unless you also believe that is what 1 Peter 4 is saying).

Have we brought the selling of indulgences back into vogue based on 1 Peter?

 

[NathanH83]

Clap, clap, clap.
Beautiful irrelevant speech.

Now as a Moderator, why don’t you explain the correct meaning of 1 Peter 4 to your errant brother (NathanH83) that is redefining “agape” as giving money so our sins will be forgiven … (unless you also believe that is what 1 Peter 4 is saying).

Have we brought the selling of indulgences back into vogue based on 1 Peter?

Look at what Peter says. He says what he says. There’s no escaping that.

 

[Andrew]

Clap, clap, clap.
Beautiful irrelevant speech.

Now as a Moderator, why don’t you explain the correct meaning of 1 Peter 4 to your errant brother (NathanH83) that is redefining “agape” as giving money so our sins will be forgiven … (unless you also believe that is what 1 Peter 4 is saying).

Have we brought the selling of indulgences back into vogue based on 1 Peter?

The RCC took OT temple rites and placed them above Jesus' crucifixion and salvation through him. Tobit and almsgiving is in no sense different from the other OT quotes I posted.
About Nathan's quote, the gift giving was from God to his elect, the gift of Charity comes from God.

 

[Andrew]

Look at what Peter says. He says what he says. There’s no escaping that.

Giving to the needy is almsgiving and is associated with Charity, God rewards those who give... Jesus even taught that giving to the poor is giving to Him... but somehow today it's heresy and works salvation.

How hard it is for a rich man to get into Heaven?

 

[Andrew]

Clap, clap, clap.
Beautiful irrelevant speech.

Now as a Moderator, why don’t you explain the correct meaning of 1 Peter 4 to your errant brother (NathanH83) that is redefining “agape” as giving money so our sins will be forgiven … (unless you also believe that is what 1 Peter 4 is saying).

Have we brought the selling of indulgences back into vogue based on 1 Peter?

Now that I'm off work I can answer your question a little clearer.

In the OT God rewards those who practice alms-giving.

In the NT God rewards those who practice alms-giving.

.

 

[atpollard]

The RCC took OT temple rites and placed them above Jesus' crucifixion and salvation through him. Tobit and almsgiving is in no sense different from the other OT quotes I posted.
About Nathan's quote, the gift giving was from God to his elect, the gift of Charity comes from God.

Now that I'm off work I can answer your question a little clearer.

In the OT God rewards those who practice alms-giving.

In the NT God rewards those who practice alms-giving.

.

An underwhelming exegesis of 1 Peter 4 and it’s use of “agape”.
Whatever.
Huddle with Tobit and read about giving cash to the poor to buy forgiveness from God if that’s your thing.
I will pass.

 

[NathanH83]

An underwhelming exegesis of 1 Peter 4 and it’s use of “agape”.
Whatever.
Huddle with Tobit and read about giving cash to the poor to buy forgiveness from God if that’s your thing.
I will pass.

Why did Peter say charity covers a multitude of sins? I mean, seriously, we’re just reading what it says. Even if it does mean love, how does that make sense? How does love cover sins? I thought only the shedding of blood can do that.

 

[Andrew]

An underwhelming exegesis of 1 Peter 4 and it’s use of “agape”.
Whatever.
Huddle with Tobit and read about giving cash to the poor to buy forgiveness from God if that’s your thing.
I will pass.

I never said that alms-giving will earn you salvation, that's ridiculous

 

[atpollard]

I never said that alms-giving will earn you salvation, that's ridiculous

Really.

Nathan does, see …

Why did Peter say charity covers a multitude of sins?

And you do say …

Tobit is no different than the others.

And the Tobit quote that everyone is talking about you listed as …

“Almsgiving delivers from death, and it will purge away every sin. Those who perform deeds of charity and of righteousness will have fullness of life;” (Tobit 12:9)

So does Tobit say that “almsgiving will purge away every sin” or not? (Just as I claimed it did, and you assure me you never said.)

 

[NathanH83]

Really.

Nathan does, see …



And you do say …



And the Tobit quote that everyone is talking about you listed as …


So does Tobit say that “almsgiving will purge away every sin” or not? (Just as I claimed it did, and you assure me you never said.)

What Tobit says isn’t really too different from what Jesus or Peter says. If this is your main gripe against the Apocrypha, then it’s a pretty sad pathetic one.

 

[Andrew]

Really.

Nathan does, see …



And you do say …



And the Tobit quote that everyone is talking about you listed as …


So does Tobit say that “almsgiving will purge away every sin” or not? (Just as I claimed it did, and you assure me you never said.)

Still no different than atonement and redemption in the OT.

“Alms atone for sins. He who does a kindness is remembered afterward; when he falls, he finds a support.” (Ecclesiasticus 3:29-30)

“Redeem thy sins by almsdeeds, and thine iniquities by showing mercy to the poor.” (Daniel 4:27)

 

[atpollard]

What Tobit says isn’t really too different from what Jesus or Peter says.

Still no different than atonement and redemption in the OT.

 

[NathanH83]

Still no different than atonement and redemption in the OT.

“Alms atone for sins. He who does a kindness is remembered afterward; when he falls, he finds a support.” (Ecclesiasticus 3:29-30)

“Redeem thy sins by almsdeeds, and thine iniquities by showing mercy to the poor.” (Daniel 4:27)

How does King Nebuchadnezzer break off his iniquities by showing mercy to the poor? Hmmm….

Therefore, O king, let my advice be acceptable to you; break off your sins by being righteous, and your iniquities by showing mercy to the poor. Perhaps there may be a lengthening of your prosperity.”
Daniel 4:27 - Bible Gateway passage: Daniel 4:27 - New King James Version

Gosh, isn’t it crazy how Daniel sounds like Tobit sometimes??

 

[Andrew]

How does King Nebuchadnezzer break off his iniquities by showing mercy to the poor? Hmmm….

Therefore, O king, let my advice be acceptable to you; break off your sins by being righteous, and your iniquities by showing mercy to the poor. Perhaps there may be a lengthening of your prosperity.”
Daniel 4:27 - Bible Gateway passage: Daniel 4:27 - New King James Version

Gosh, isn’t it crazy how Daniel sounds like Tobit sometimes??

Atpollard seems to be hung up on OT legalism... however I doubt that, perhaps he believes he can convince the audience that we are placing Tobit above Gospel by insinuating we belong to some "Tobian cult" that developed outside the old and new testament... since you know, it's heresy and totally original and radical to preach that we should give to the poor as believers also... as for truth, the Bible is riddled about with post it notes prompting us to hasten unto the poor merciful deeds by the giving of alms and hospitality for doing so we may also entertain angels unknowingly as some likewise have done in the faith in times past.