Who entertained angels unaware, as stated in Hebrews 13:2?

[Andrew]

Gideon knew it was an angel the whole time. He just had some doubts, and so asked for a sign. When the angel performed the sign, then he knew for sure it was an angel. Besides, he didn’t entertain him either.

Nice try, but no cigar.

That was my initial reaction as well.
"if now I have found grace in YOUR sight give me a sign that YOU speaketh with me"

The LORD is speaking to Gideon through an angel of the LORD telling Gideon what he has planned of him, Gideon obviously knows he is speaking with the Lords messenger given the very context of the conversation they are having and he probably felt overwhelmed in disbelief (pinch me if this is real!) so he addressed the LORD to ask the LORD if he really is talking with the LORD and what does God do that others cant? Perform signs and miracles, that's why Gideon requested one.
Once he got his sign he knew this was for real and was ecstatic!

 

[Andrew]

That is not correct. Gideon addresses the angel at first as "Lord" (v. 13), not LORD.

And Gideon said to him, “Please, my lord (i.e. אָדוֹן = Lord), if the LORD is with us, why then has all this happened to us? And where are all his wonderful deeds that our fathers recounted to us, saying, ‘Did not the LORD bring us up from Egypt?’ But now the LORD has forsaken us and given us into the hand of Midian.”

Then Gideon does the same thing again in verse 15.

And he said [i.e. Gideon] to him, “Please, Lord (i.e. אָדוֹן = Lord), how can I save Israel? Behold, my clan is the weakest in Manasseh, and I am the least in my father’s house.”

The context of their conversation shows that the angel isn't playing mind games with Gideon, Gideon is pondering if he really is speaking with the LORD, I call that HYPER awareness of angels

 

[Origen]

The context of their conversation shows that the angel isn't playing mind games with Gideon, Gideon is pondering if he really is speaking with the LORD, I call that HYPER awareness of angels

First I never suggested anyone was playing mind game so your point is irrelevant.

Second, how does that change anything I said? I said Gideon addresses the angel at first as "Lord" (v. 13), not LORD.

And Gideon said to him, “Please, my lord (i.e. אָדוֹן = Lord), if the LORD is with us, why then has all this happened to us? And where are all his wonderful deeds that our fathers recounted to us, saying, ‘Did not the LORD bring us up from Egypt?’ But now the LORD has forsaken us and given us into the hand of Midian.”

Then Gideon does the same thing again in verse 15.

And he said [i.e. Gideon] to him, “Please, Lord (i.e. אָדוֹן = Lord), how can I save Israel? Behold, my clan is the weakest in Manasseh, and I am the least in my father’s house.”

At first Gideon does in fact addresses the angel as "Lord," not LORD. That is what the text states.

 

[Andrew]

First I never claimed anyone was playing mind game so your point is irrelevant

Second, how does that change anything I said? I said Gideon addresses the angel at first as "Lord" (v. 13), not LORD.

And Gideon said to him, “Please, my lord (i.e. אָדוֹן = Lord), if the LORD is with us, why then has all this happened to us? And where are all his wonderful deeds that our fathers recounted to us, saying, ‘Did not the LORD bring us up from Egypt?’ But now the LORD has forsaken us and given us into the hand of Midian.”

Then Gideon does the same thing again in verse 15.

And he said [i.e. Gideon] to him, “Please, Lord (i.e. אָדוֹן = Lord), how can I save Israel? Behold, my clan is the weakest in Manasseh, and I am the least in my father’s house.”

Gideon does in fact addresses the at first angel as "Lord," not LORD. That is what the text states.

I stated the same exact thing earlier and found that it makes no difference because Gideon was hyper aware of possibly speaking with an angel of the Lord given the very context of their conversation

 

[Origen]

I stated the same exact thing earlier and found that it makes no difference because Gideon was hyper aware of possibly speaking with an angel of the Lord given the very context of their conversation

Gideon merely being aware something was possible is hardly the same thing knowing. Also the text never says he knew it was the angel of the Lord until verse 22 where is states: "Gideon perceived that he was the angel of the LORD."

 

[Andrew]

Gideon merely being aware something was possible is hardly the same thing knowing. Also the text never says he knew it was the angel of the Lord until verse 22 where is states: "Gideon perceived that he was the angel of the LORD."

Did he not ask the angel directly for the LORD to make it known to him that it really is HE whom Gideon is speaking with?

He was extremely aware of the possibilty and likelihood that his encounter could actually be divine and has even prayed for a response from God but became reluctant and weak in faith so of course why not ask for a little help from the LORD if the things told to him are true.

Thomas had doubt, was he entertaining Jesus unaware?

Gideon clearly did not believe 100% certain that he was talking to nothing more than a mortal man, in fact he was so sceptical of it being a man that he requested a sign from the LORD,

 

[NathanH83]

That was my initial reaction as well.
"if now I have found grace in YOUR sight give me a sign that YOU speaketh with me"

The LORD is speaking to Gideon through an angel of the LORD telling Gideon what he has planned of him, Gideon obviously knows he is speaking with the Lords messenger given the very context of the conversation they are having and he probably felt overwhelmed in disbelief (pinch me if this is real!) so he addressed the LORD to ask the LORD if he really is talking with the LORD and what does God do that others cant? Perform signs and miracles, that's why Gideon requested one.
Once he got his sign he knew this was for real and was ecstatic!

Exactly

 

[pinacled]

Gideon merely being aware something was possible is hardly the same thing knowing. Also the text never says he knew it was the angel of the Lord until verse 22 where is states: "Gideon perceived that he was the angel of the LORD."

I'll add that every mention of Angel's in the TaNaKh(old testament) a message is given in Truth followed by signs of miracles.

Whereas the alleged angel that visited tobit deceitfully concealed their identity and gave no glory to the Most High as the aforementioned Angel's had.

Blessings Always

 

[pinacled]

Did he not ask the angel directly for the LORD to make it known to him that it really is HE whom Gideon is speaking with?

He was extremely aware of the possibilty and likelihood that his encounter could actually be divine and has even prayed for a response from God but became reluctant and weak in faith so of course why not ask for a little help from the LORD if the things told to him are true.

Thomas had doubt, was he entertaining Jesus unaware?

Gideon clearly did not believe 100% certain that he was talking to nothing more than a mortal man, in fact he was so sceptical of it being a man that he requested a sign from the LORD,

Yes,
Thomas was "entertaining jesus unaware" and likewise the other disciples as recorded in acts.
Each account of Angel's visited in the past there followed a revealing Truth.

The 2 Mary's entertaining an angel unawares.
[ And when they looked, they saw that the stone was rolled away: for it was very great.

5 And entering into the sepulchre, they saw a young man sitting on the right side, clothed in a long white garment; and they were affrighted.

6 And he saith unto them, Be not affrighted: Ye seek Jesus of Nazareth, which was crucified: he is risen; he is not here: behold the place where they laid him.

7 But go your way, tell his disciples and Peter that he goeth before you into Galilee: there shall ye see him, as he said unto you.]



Blessings Always

 

[Josiah]

The fact that the author of Hebrews didn’t say is even further evidence.

.... actually, it's proof that we don't know.





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[NathanH83]

I'll add that every mention of Angel's in the TaNaKh(old testament) a message is given in Truth followed by signs of miracles.

Whereas the alleged angel that visited tobit deceitfully concealed their identity and gave no glory to the Most High as the aforementioned Angel's had.

Blessings Always

Hebrews says people have entertained angels unaware. How could they possibly be unaware if the angel didn’t conceal his identity?

[Staff edit]

 

[Josiah]

Hebrews says people have entertained angels unaware. How could they possibly be unaware if the angel didn’t conceal his identity?

Irrelevant.

And sorry, but questions substantiate absolutely NOTHING.

Hebrews doesn't state who these people were. Now, unless you 've spoken with the author of Hebrews and he told you - and you can prove this - then you don't know who he is speaking of. Trust matters. Honesty matters. Now, if that author DID speak personally to YOU and told YOU their names, then prove it. Then you can make a claim.

Hello, McFly? Hello? Anybody home?
Think McFly.




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[Origen]

Did he not ask the angel directly for the LORD to make it known to him that it really is HE whom Gideon is speaking with?

No Gideon did not directly ask, but on the other hand the text never directly states he did know either.

He was extremely aware of the possibilty and likelihood that his encounter could actually be divine and has even prayed for a response from God but became reluctant and weak in faith so of course why not ask for a little help from the LORD if the things told to him are true.

Again, Gideon merely being aware something was possible is hardly the same thing knowing.

Also the text never says he knew it was the angel of the Lord until verse 22 where is states: "Gideon perceived that he was the angel of the LORD."

There is no reason to point out in the narrative that at some time after the initial meeting Gideon "perceived that he was the angel of the LORD" unless he did not know it before that time. Since it was not until verse 22 that Gideon does perceive that he was the angel of the LORD, then anytime before he must have not perceived yet.

Thomas had doubt, was he entertaining Jesus unaware?

The two example are not really analogous.

Gideon clearly did not believe 100% certain that he was talking to nothing more than a mortal man, in fact he was so sceptical of it being a man that he requested a sign from the LORD,

If Gideon was not 100% certain as you claim, clearly he did not know for sure. He may have suspected, but again suspecting something to be true is a far cry from knowing it.

 

[Andrew]

I'll add that every mention of Angel's in the TaNaKh(old testament) a message is given in Truth followed by signs of miracles.

Whereas the alleged angel that visited tobit deceitfully concealed their identity and gave no glory to the Most High as the aforementioned Angel's had.

Blessings Always

According to Paul angels can and will conceal their true identity which is precisely their method in which to test us..

"I was sent to put you to the test. At the same time, however, God sent me to heal you and your daughter-in-law Sarah.

I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand and serve before the Glory of the Lord.”

Greatly shaken, the two of them fell prostrate in fear.

But Raphael said to them: “Do not fear; peace be with you! Bless God now and forever.

As for me, when I was with you, I was not acting out of any favor on my part, but by God’s will. So bless God every day; give praise with song"

Raphael didnt give any glory to God you say?

 

[NathanH83]

.... actually, it's proof that we don't know.





.

We DO know because it’s obvious

 

[NathanH83]

According to Paul angels can and will conceal their true identity which is precisely their method in which to test us..

"I was sent to put you to the test. At the same time, however, God sent me to heal you and your daughter-in-law Sarah.

I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand and serve before the Glory of the Lord.”

Greatly shaken, the two of them fell prostrate in fear.

But Raphael said to them: “Do not fear; peace be with you! Bless God now and forever.

As for me, when I was with you, I was not acting out of any favor on my part, but by God’s will. So bless God every day; give praise with song"

Raphael didnt give any glory to God you say?

He clearly has no clue what he’s talking about. Raphael obviously gave glory to God.

 

[Andrew]

No Gideon did not directly ask, but on the other hand the text never directly states he did know either.


Again, Gideon merely being aware something was possible is hardly the same thing knowing.

Also the text never says he knew it was the angel of the Lord until verse 22 where is states: "Gideon perceived that he was the angel of the LORD."

There is no reason to point out in the narrative that at some time after the initial meeting Gideon "perceived that he was the angel of the LORD" unless he did not know it before that time. Since it was not until verse 22 that Gideon does perceive that he was the angel of the LORD, then anytime before he must have not perceived yet.


The two example are not really analogous.


If Gideon was not 100% certain as you claim, clearly he did not know for sure. He may have suspected, but again suspecting something to be true is a far cry from knowing it.

How exactly was Gideon entertaining the angel? the entire dialogue is about Gods calling and Gideon seeking confirmation from the Lord that the calling is true

It's typically a dead give away when someone is greeted in the bible with "blessed art thou the Lord is with thee" and begins outlining the mission the Lord has called them to.. how could Gideon be so completely oblivious to think anything other than "this individual is presenting himself as a divine messenger sent· from God"?

That kind of blows his cover if the angel is trying to pass as a human to make others "unaware" of his true identity.

The angel presented himself as a messenger of the Lord, Gideon like Thomas lacked faith to believe what they truly desired .. the LORD gave them absolute faith, Gideons faith was restored and he completed his mission.

 

[pinacled]

According to Paul angels can and will conceal their true identity which is precisely their method in which to test us..

"I was sent to put you to the test. At the same time, however, God sent me to heal you and your daughter-in-law Sarah.

I am Raphael, one of the seven angels who stand and serve before the Glory of the Lord.”

Greatly shaken, the two of them fell prostrate in fear.

But Raphael said to them: “Do not fear; peace be with you! Bless God now and forever.

As for me, when I was with you, I was not acting out of any favor on my part, but by God’s will. So bless God every day; give praise with song"

Raphael didnt give any glory to God you say?

Never by deceit does an angel conceal their identity.

25 Bible Verses about Lying

Bible Verses about Lying - The LORD detests lying lips, but he delights in people who are trustworthy… Save me, LORD, from lying lips and from deceitful tongues… Whoever conceals hatred with lying lips and spreads slander is a fool… For, “Whoever would love life and see good days must keep...

dailyverses.net

Only by still silence do the angels work as a messenger till asked to reveal a Truth.

Ole sh'aul warned of Satan presenting themselves as an angel of light.

And what is also warned is that truth has no part with deception.
To which I believe ole sh'aul is warning about the book of To bit to be luciferian.

Blessings Always

 

[pinacled]

How exactly was Gideon entertaining the angel? the entire dialogue is about Gods calling and Gideon seeking confirmation from the Lord that the calling is true

It's typically a dead give away when someone is greeted in the bible with "blessed art thou the Lord is with thee" and begins outlining the mission the Lord has called them to.. how could Gideon be so completely oblivious to think anything other than "this individual is presenting himself as a divine messenger sent· from God"?

That kind of blows his cover if the angel is trying to pass as a human to make others "unaware" of his true identity.

The angel presented himself as a messenger of the Lord, Gideon like Thomas lacked faith to believe what they truly desired .. the LORD gave them absolute faith, Gideons faith was restored and he completed his mission.

"I was sent to put you to the test. At the same time, however, God sent me to heal you and your daughter-in-law Sarah."

The above citation is opposite from Hebrews and instruction given by The Lord of Lights to test the spirits!
1 John 4

 

[Origen]

How exactly was Gideon entertaining the angel?

Now I am shocked.

"Please do not depart from here until I come to you and bring out my present and set it before you.” And he said, “I will stay till you return.”

So Gideon went into his house and prepared a young goat and unleavened cakes from an ehah of flour. The meat he put in a basket, and the broth he put in a pot, and brought them to him under the terebinth and presented them.

Gideon (1) requested that he not leave, (2) he told him he was going give his "present and set it before you," in other words served him, and then, (3) Gideon prepared him a meal, (4) and then brought it to him.

I doubt know what you call it but when someone request another not to leave, tell them he is going to give that person a present, prepare a meal for that person, and then serves it, that sounds a lot like entertaining.