WORKS

[YourTruthGod]

The good works spoken by Paul refer to the works that God has prepared for each person who is saved.



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Don't confuse the works we have to do to get saved with the good things to do while we are saved.

Read Ephesians 1:15-16.

Paul had just got through thanking the Ephesians for showing the Saints love.

The Ephesians were probably very hospitable and giving to the Apostles who visited them.

When we are saved, we are given the Holy Spirit. Jesus saves us for having a believing heart that is sorry for sins that we repent of doing. We then as saved people continue in God’s goodness by doing good works, good works like the Ephesians did, as they probably welcomed the Apostles into their homes, fed them, washed their feet, let them sleep there, and gave them money for their mission.

Paul lets us know that the Ephesians were not saved because the Ephesians were kind to the Apostles and other Christians as opposed to the obedience that does save. The Ephesians were not saved because they took good care of those preaching the gospel. Paul lets us know that those things they did are good works that we also do after we are saved, but not to be saved. No one can do works like that to get salvation. They had to believe in Jesus and repent of their sins, they had to call on the name of the Lord to save them.

 

[Andrew]

Now there is something else you might want to stop doing---preaching the false doctrine that Jesus saves us in a state of unbelief and disobedience.

That is your believer sir, you believe that the unfaithful can obey :/

 

[Andrew]

Smoke from those cigarettes come out of your mouth.

Smoke is not words

 

[RichWh1]

YTG

Ephesians 1:15-16 has nothing to do with works for salvation!


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[RichWh1]

Could someone please explain what "works" actually are??? give me examples please!

This might be of some help

31*“But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32*All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33*and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left. 34*“Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35*For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36*naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.’ 37*Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? 38*And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You? 39*When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40*The King will answer and say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.’
Matthew 25:31-40 - NASB



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[MoreCoffee]

Nothing there about repenting of your sins.

Repentance is so fundamental to the gospel message that it is not repeated in the commandments that the Lord Jesus Christ gave to those who are his disciples because they had already received the gospel message and knew what it commanded. But the Lord Jesus Christ does command repentance in the announcement of the gospel saying Repent and believe the gospel because the Kingdom of God is at hand.

In addition, you named things no infant could understand.

Every infant baptised into Christ learns the gospel and grows in holiness for as long as they receive the word of Christ taught to them by their parents or guardians in Christ. Thus they grow into responsible children who obey the commandments of God. So you are incorrect to presume that no infant can understand since every infant in the covenant people of God receives gifts fitting to its age and abilities as it matures and thus becomes more and more a responsible member of the covenant community which God creates in the Church.

 

[YourTruthGod]

YTG

Ephesians 1:15-16 has nothing to do with works for salvation!


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You have a made up shameful untrue word for obedience to Christ and you call it 'works salvation'.

Stop speaking things that are not in the Bible.

Show one scripture that says what you do about obedience to get saved and stay saved is a false 'works salvation'.

 

[YourTruthGod]

Smoke is not words

You are trying to defend the sin of smoking. Why?

 

[YourTruthGod]

That is your believer sir, you believe that the unfaithful can obey :/

You don't even make sense. The unfaithful can obey? You mean those without faith?

God does NOT save anyone until they BELIEVE AND OBEY.

They can believe and then obey, or obey then believe.

NO ONE IS SAVED UNLESS THEY DO BOTH!

Good grief, is it really so hard for you to understand?

 

[YourTruthGod]

This might be of some help

31*“But when the Son of Man comes in His glory, and all the angels with Him, then He will sit on His glorious throne. 32*All the nations will be gathered before Him; and He will separate them from one another, as the shepherd separates the sheep from the goats; 33*and He will put the sheep on His right, and the goats on the left. 34*“Then the King will say to those on His right, ‘Come, you who are blessed of My Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world. 35*For I was hungry, and you gave Me something to eat; I was thirsty, and you gave Me something to drink; I was a stranger, and you invited Me in; 36*naked, and you clothed Me; I was sick, and you visited Me; I was in prison, and you came to Me.’ 37*Then the righteous will answer Him, ‘Lord, when did we see You hungry, and feed You, or thirsty, and give You something to drink? 38*And when did we see You a stranger, and invite You in, or naked, and clothe You? 39*When did we see You sick, or in prison, and come to You?’ 40*The King will answer and say to them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did it to one of these brothers of Mine, even the least of them, you did it to Me.’
Matthew 25:31-40 - NASB



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That is about the Apostles, the disciples, who would be thirsty, hungry, or put in prison because their preaching the Word of God.

 

[Andrew]

You are trying to defend the sin of smoking. Why?

Like I said, that's between me and God, not you. At least I am open about it, so please stop bringing it up. I am not acting like I have excelled entirely of being the most 'Christ like' I can possibly be. You pretend that you sin "barely" and if you really believe you can sin no more (which you have said before) then you are an outright liar and you spit in the face of Grace! You claim you no longer need to excell in Christ Holiness because you are completely equally Holy as can be to him, yet you spend hours and hours on this site in pursuit of boasting arrogantly about your faithless obedience , as if God really cares about your boastfulness and pride knowing that you reject his Grace and knowing that our duty is to strive to be more Christ Like, stop insulting "Faith" believers opposed to your self "works" believer... ever heard of Grace? you obviously stand above all of the Apostles because you need no room for perfection or maturity or grace, you are a very much so like a self righteous but wannabe Pharisee...
The 10 commandments are fairly simple to obey for a man of FAITH btw, you act like it's some big accomplishment, you act like everything Jesus ever said must be so extreme that a person claiming to have Faith could not possibly follow his teachings... You have it backwards!
Faith comes first because with out it NO ONE CAN BE OBEDIENT BECAUSE THEY CANT TELL RIGHT FROM WRONG!!!!.
You believe Jesus was just as obedient as you so he's nothing special to behold for you have said "anyone can obey anyone" so I guess Jesus was nothing more than just a colleague of yours in this manner, you accuse people who claim Faith is the forerunner of obedience (as scripture says) as being anti obedient/anti Christian when you have no grounds to make accusations on people YOU DO NOT KNOW AND WILL NEVER KNOW!.
Seek community!
Say all you want about me, call me a sinner because I mentioned in another thread that I recently took up smoking again, im not fake I spoke truth, im not proud of it and I know God would rather me quit and btw he has delivered me from it several times before, but who ARE YOU to parade around the forum pretending to be some obediently sinless and Holy Pope figure while teaching the extinguishing of GRACE and boasting that your so called 'faithless' obedience saved you without the help of the Holy Spirit nor Faith NOR God or his free gifts.
You repent so I imagine you sin? You sin 7 times a day actually, but answer me these questions, are you so sure that you are the Holiest today now and forever and have no room for improvement? Have you been the first person to succeed in reaching Christ perfection as we continue daily to strive to be more like him?
Perhaps you should leave Christian Theology debate because your brilliance and countenance is too overwhelming for us reckless and degenerate and heretic Christians who believe in Faith from God for Faithful obedience and God given Grace towards Christ perfection and maturity and workmanship and Charity.
Get off your high horse, works before Faith is but filthy rags, no one wants to join your one man denomination that teaches faithless works

 

[YourTruthGod]

Like I said, that's between me and God, not you.

You are the one who said it publicly that you smoke.

You are badly mistaken when you say it is between God and you, because you are preaching untruths about smoking when you say it is not a sin.

As for the rest of your post to me, I stopped reading it at this point.

You need to stop lying about me. Quote me when you say I said something controversial.

 

[YourTruthGod]

It is never ever wrong to obey God.

There isn't a wrong time and a wrong way to obey God.

There is no such shame in obeying God to get saved and to stay saved.

The Bible NEVER EVER reprimands ANYONE at ANYTIME for obeying God.

There are many people who have been taught wrong about God and I am just trying to help.

There are people who try to shame people for preaching obedience to Christ to get saved and to stay saved; they call it a 'works salvation'. There is no such reprimand in the Bible.

 

[Andrew]

You don't even make sense. The unfaithful can obey? You mean those without faith?

God does NOT save anyone until they BELIEVE AND OBEY.

They can believe and then obey, or obey then believe.

NO ONE IS SAVED UNLESS THEY DO BOTH!

Good grief, is it really so hard for you to understand?

YOU claim that a person who has NO FAITH - Faith which has EVERYTHING to do with ones covenant with Almighty GOD -MUST OBEY FIRST before even receiving the FAITH that ALL *** TRUE BELIEVERS*** MUST HAVE TO OBEY to begin with!

HAVE FAITH that what you BELIEVE is TRUTH and the HOLY SPIRIT will put in YOU the FAITHFUL and OBEDIENT WORKS THAT GOD HAS SPOKEN IN THROUGH CHRIST and from the foundation of the world

 

[YourTruthGod]

YOU claim that a person who has NO FAITH - Faith which has EVERYTHING to do with ones covenant with Almighty GOD -MUST OBEY FIRST before even receiving the FAITH that ALL *** TRUE BELIEVERS*** MUST HAVE TO OBEY to begin with!

You are lying and should be more careful.

I have explained it to you so many times so there is no excuse for you. Evidently you don't think what I say is important enough to not bear false witness against me.

Believing God IS obeying.

JESUS SHOWS US IN JOHN 7:17 that if we want to believe/have faith, then we can do what he says and then we will find out.

HAVE FAITH that what you BELIEVE is TRUTH and the HOLY SPIRIT will put in YOU the FAITHFUL and OBEDIENT WORKS THAT GOD HAS SPOKEN IN THROUGH CHRIST and from the foundation of the world

You are not speaking what the Bible says. You are speaking against it.

God does NOT put faith in people and all people who do have faith do not all obey.

Now start listening more careful and do not lie and post things repeatedly THAT ARE NOT TRUE about me, or the Bible.

 

[Andrew]

You are the one who said it publicly that you smoke.

You are badly mistaken when you say it is between God and you, because you are preaching untruths about smoking when you say it is not a sin.

As for the rest of your post to me, I stopped reading it at this point.

You need to stop lying about me. Quote me when you say I said something controversial.

A Holy man and obedient servant of Christ would speak most compassionately to his brother and offer advice and share inspirational scriptures and encouragement if he truly was concerned over that persons actions.
You provided none, I shared that moment because I had 2 deaths in the same month and my mom got diagnosed with a terminal illness, so I relapsed, Im not happy about it and I know God sees it as being weak in faith but he I will overcome and believe me it's no party, its an off and on struggle that I have dealt with for a long time. I actually enjoy not smoking, so I see this as a test, when I turn 35 (in a few months) I plan on quiting for the final time if I don't quit sooner.

But shame on you! Oh I'm not a Christian because I'm going through a rough tribulation and because I don't believe your "Faithless Obedience" philosophy?

 

[Andrew]

You are lying and should be more careful.

I have explained it to you so many times so there is no excuse for you. Evidently you don't think what I say is important enough to not bear false witness against me.

Believing God IS obeying.

JESUS SHOWS US IN JOHN 7:17 that if we want to believe/have faith, then we can do what he says and then we will find out.



You are not speaking what the Bible says. You are speaking against it.

God does NOT put faith in people and all people who do have faith do not all obey.

Now start listening more careful and do not lie and post things repeatedly THAT ARE NOT TRUE about me, or the Bible.

Wow even MC can't get through to you, and he is the CH spokesperson for works + faith.
YTG FIND A CHURCH MY FRIEND!!
I can see you at a Pentecostal or a Catholic church (both are the original apostolic church )
SERIOUSLY YOU LACK COMMUNITY

 

[RichWh1]

That is about the Apostles, the disciples, who would be thirsty, hungry, or put in prison because their preaching the Word of God.

Are you certain that Jesus was talking about the apostles Only? If so why do you think that?



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[MennoSota]

A Holy man and obedient servant of Christ would speak most compassionately to his brother and offer advice and share inspirational scriptures and encouragement if he truly was concerned over that persons actions.
You provided none, I shared that moment because I had 2 deaths in the same month and my mom got diagnosed with a terminal illness, so I relapsed, Im not happy about it and I know God sees it as being weak in faith but he I will overcome and believe me it's no party, its an off and on struggle that I have dealt with for a long time. I actually enjoy not smoking, so I see this as a test, when I turn 35 (in a few months) I plan on quiting for the final time if I don't quit sooner.

But shame on you! Oh I'm not a Christian because I'm going through a rough tribulation and because I don't believe your "Faithless Obedience" philosophy?

“I intend to smoke a good cigar to the glory of God before I go to bed tonight.” ~ CH Spurgeon

Spurgeon found smoking a cigar relaxing and it helped him think and thus worship. Was it good for his health? No. But, having a burger and fries isn't any better.
Very few people eat well and only healthy foods. If our actions are done to cover up pain, we should work toward giving God that pain. But our actions can also be to the glory of God, as Spurgeon understood.
Don't let smoking distract from worship. If you can worship with a cigarette and a beer, then praise God while having a smoke and a drink. If you are covering pain or numbing it with a smoke or a beer, then consider letting it go until God heals your pain.
Just my thoughts.

 

[Andrew]

“I intend to smoke a good cigar to the glory of God before I go to bed tonight.” ~ CH Spurgeon

Spurgeon found smoking a cigar relaxing and it helped him think and thus worship. Was it good for his health? No. But, having a burger and fries isn't any better.
Very few people eat well and only healthy foods. If our actions are done to cover up pain, we should work toward giving God that pain. But our actions can also be to the glory of God, as Spurgeon understood.
Don't let smoking distract from worship. If you can worship with a cigarette and a beer, then praise God while having a smoke and a drink. If you are covering pain or numbing it with a smoke or a beer, then consider letting it go until God heals your pain.
Just my thoughts.

Thanks Menno, about drinking, I won't drink more than a 6 pack and even then I usually giving my dad a couple, I never get stumbling drunk and I hate strong drink, but I tell yeah, when me and my dad have a couple of drinks over a bbq we usually ALWAYS end up discussing Faith and I show im scriptures when he asks me specific questions, sort of the Catholic side in me but drinking wine would actually make me tipsy, never cared for it. Jesus drank wine, I believe Timothy was prescribed wine for his stomach ailments (correct me if im wrong)
I thank you for your words, lighting up doesn't draw me away from God but I need to stop regardless because it's not healthy.
2018 was by far the worst year of my life, the good that came from it is it has drawn my mom closer to God, I'm so proud of her, been going with her to her Catholic church for support, I have no problem with the visits there it's just reaaally boring! lol
And yes, Heart disease caused by fatty Fast foods is the number one leading cause of death in America.
I guess if you eat fatty foods you are against God and go to hell :/