Love

[Arsenios]

It is something that one decides to do.

Indeed, one must decide...

The Call of God is always answered...
To one degree or another...
Unto Salvation or Damnation...
Unto Life of death...

We answer by what we do...
And by what we do not do...
By what we fail to do...
By what we refuse to do...


Personally, from death to Life...
When death held no fear...
When Life was unknown...
Then came Life...

What we do matters...


Arsenios

 

[YourTruthGod]

There's something that the Lord said that deserves some attention; most Christians think that everything that Jesus said deserves attention but some things have more impact than others and some make a stronger call on how Christians ought to live than others. So here is the quote

Matthew 22:34-40 But the Pharisees, hearing that he had caused the Sadducees to be silent, came together as one. 35 And one of them, a doctor of the law, questioned him, to test him: 36 "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?" 37 Jesus said to him: " "You shall love the Lord your God from all your heart, and with all your soul and with all your mind." 38 This is the greatest and first commandment. 39 But the second is similar to it: "You shall love your neighbour as yourself." 40 On these two commandments the entire law depends, and also the prophets."​

Is it reasonable to ask that Christians do these two things?

Loving your neighbor is doing them no harm and it is how you obey the commands of God such as do not murder, do not commit adultery, bear false witness, steal...

If you are loving your neighbor by not harming him, then you are obeying the commands "Do not ___".

If you do something against your neighbor then you are harming them and not loving them and you are guilty of breaking the whole love of love your neighbor by doing them harm.

 

[Andrew]

Loving your neighbor is doing them no harm and it is how you obey the commands of God such as do not murder, do not commit adultery, bear false witness, steal...

If you are loving your neighbor by not harming him, then you are obeying the commands "Do not ___".

If you do something against your neighbor then you are harming them and not loving them and you are guilty of breaking the whole love of love your neighbor by doing them harm.

Exactly

 

[YourTruthGod]

James was speaking of the ROYAL LAW OF LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR.

Love is 'not harming your neighbor' that is how we love our neighbors; we do no harm to them. See Romans 13:10.

If you do not harm your neighbor by not murdering your neighbor, it is good and you have obeyed a commandment of do not murder---do not murder, love your neighbor.

If you do not harm your neighbor by committing adultery with your neighbor's wife, then you have obeyed another commandment, and you further show that you love your neighbor.

If you do not harm your neighbor by bearing false witness against them, you have done right and obeyed yet another command of the law and you still are loving your neighbor.

If you break one of the commandments in the law and STEAL from your neighbor, you have HARMED your neighbor, AND NOW YOU ARE GUILTY OF BREAKING THE WHOLE ROYAL LAW OF LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR.

 

[Andrew]

James was speaking of the ROYAL LAW OF LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR.

Love is 'not harming your neighbor' that is how we love our neighbors; we do no harm to them. See Romans 13:10.

If you do not harm your neighbor by not murdering your neighbor, it is good and you have obeyed a commandment of do not murder---do not murder, love your neighbor.

If you do not harm your neighbor by committing adultery with your neighbor's wife, then you have obeyed another commandment, and you further show that you love your neighbor.

If you do not harm your neighbor by bearing false witness against them, you have done right and obeyed yet another command of the law and you still are loving your neighbor.

If you break one of the commandments in the law and STEAL from your neighbor, you have HARMED your neighbor, AND NOW YOU ARE GUILTY OF BREAKING THE WHOLE ROYAL LAW OF LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR.

This is why the sermon on the mount makes sense to me, the 10 commandments was always about love for your neighbors.

 

[YourTruthGod]

This is why the sermon on the mount makes sense to me, the 10 commandments was always about love for your neighbors.

I don't understand what you mean.

 

[MoreCoffee]

This is why the sermon on the mount makes sense to me, the 10 commandments was always about love for your neighbors.

I do not think that commanding sabbath keeping on pain of death is about love of neighbour unless you define love as stoning a law breaker.

 

[YourTruthGod]

This is why the sermon on the mount makes sense to me, the 10 commandments was always about love for your neighbors.

The whole law and the Prophets were about love God and your neighbor.

The new covenant is about that too.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The whole law and the Prophets were about love God and your neighbor.

The new covenant is about that too.

That sounds kind of sweeping and untrue. Some prophets gave messages to kill neighbouring people so it seems unlikely that those messages were about love.

 

[Andrew]

I do not think that commanding sabbath keeping on pain of death is about love of neighbour unless you define love as stoning a law breaker.

The 10 commandments is all about love

 

[MoreCoffee]

The 10 commandments is all about love

I am not sure why you repeated that but the sabbath commandment has a death penalty attached for disobedience so it is not about love it is about having an enforced day off and being killed if you don't.

 

[atpollard]

So saint James was right; a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

Where does James say that?

What happened to Scripture speaking with one voice when Paul stated unambiguously that we are justified by faith and not by works?
James just said that genuine faith (which does justify us) results in good works (like Paul said in Eph 3:10).

 

[YourTruthGod]

That sounds kind of sweeping and untrue. Some prophets gave messages to kill neighbouring people so it seems unlikely that those messages were about love.

So then, you are judging God?

Jesus said plainly that the whole law and the prophets are fulfilled in those two commandments.

Matthew 22:37 Jesus replied: “ ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ 38This is the first and greatest commandment. 39And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ 40 All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments.”

 

[YourTruthGod]

Where does James say that?

What happened to Scripture speaking with one voice when Paul stated unambiguously that we are justified by faith and not by works?
James just said that genuine faith (which does justify us) results in good works (like Paul said in Eph 3:10).

The only time ‘faith alone’ is mentioned in the Bible, it is to tell us what kind of faith not to have.

James 2:24 You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.

Faith alone without any right action does not save. Apostle James says such faith is DEAD.
Many denominations call that dead faith ‘saving faith’.

James 2:14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?

James 2:17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

James tells us faith alone cannot save a man.

That “dead faith” is NOT the most important kind of faith ever known.

Faith alone without works is dead. Our faith must be alive. Faith with obedience is living faith.
The works we do not have to do to justify ourselves is be circumcised, observe special days, and sacrifice animals. Those are the works that Paul is speaking about, but people misunderstand Paul to their destruction.
Peter tells us that people misunderstand Paul. Right after Peter says that, he warns us to obey. See 2 Peter 3:16, and 17.

 

[atpollard]

The only time ‘faith alone’ is mentioned in the Bible, it is to tell us what kind of faith not to have.

James 2:24 You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.

Faith alone without any right action does not save. Apostle James says such faith is DEAD.
Many denominations call that dead faith ‘saving faith’.

James 2:14 What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save them?

James 2:17 In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead.

James tells us faith alone cannot save a man.

That “dead faith” is NOT the most important kind of faith ever known.

Faith alone without works is dead. Our faith must be alive. Faith with obedience is living faith.
The works we do not have to do to justify ourselves is be circumcised, observe special days, and sacrifice animals. Those are the works that Paul is speaking about, but people misunderstand Paul to their destruction.
Peter tells us that people misunderstand Paul. Right after Peter says that, he warns us to obey. See 2 Peter 3:16, and 17.

Respectfully, the words of Paul that I am “misunderstanding” are these ...

[Rom 10:8-11 NASB] 8 But what does it say? "THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART"--that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus [as] Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

[Eph 2:1-10 NASB] 1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. 3 Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

... but you go ahead and believe that you are justified because of your “filthy rags” helping God if that makes you happy. I’ll stick with scripture and Soli Deo Gloria! (Glory to God Alone!)

Good works are the fruit of Justification, not the root of Justification.

 

[YourTruthGod]

Respectfully, the words of Paul that I am “misunderstanding” are these ...

[Rom 10:8-11 NASB] 8 But what does it say? "THE WORD IS NEAR YOU, IN YOUR MOUTH AND IN YOUR HEART"--that is, the word of faith which we are preaching, 9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus [as] Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED."

[Eph 2:1-10 NASB] 1 And you were dead in your trespasses and sins, 2 in which you formerly walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, of the spirit that is now working in the sons of disobedience. 3 Among them we too all formerly lived in the lusts of our flesh, indulging the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest. 4 But God, being rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly [places] in Christ Jesus, 7 so that in the ages to come He might show the surpassing riches of His grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, [it is] the gift of God; 9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

... but you go ahead and believe that you are justified because of your “filthy rags” helping God if that makes you happy. I’ll stick with scripture and Soli Deo Gloria! (Glory to God Alone!)

Good works are the fruit of Justification, not the root of Justification.

We have to believe what about Jesus? We have to believe that we have to obey Jesus.

Do you really think that all the scriptures that say 'believe' nullify all the scriptures that say to obey?

 

[MoreCoffee]

So then, you are judging God?

No. I am pointing out that your claim was untrue because not every message from the prophets nor every message in the bible is about love some messages are about extermination and some are about exploitation, enslavement, rape, and various other things that are not love.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Where does James say that?

Right here in these words: You see that a person is justified by works and not by faith alone.

 

[YourTruthGod]

No. I am pointing out that your claim was untrue because not every message from the prophets nor every message in the bible is about love some messages are about extermination and some are about exploitation, enslavement, rape, and various other things that are not love.

So you aren't judging God just correcting God?

 

[MoreCoffee]

What happened to Scripture speaking with one voice when Paul stated unambiguously that we are justified by faith and not by works?

Unambiguously? You take those words to mean that you're "saved by faith alone" don't you? But saint Paul never says that anyone is saved by faith alone. So the ambiguity is in how a chap interprets what saint Paul says and saint James says a person is justified by works and not by faith alone. And you seem to be unsettled by that. Maybe you're not really unsettled by it but it does appear to be unsettling for your theology. Anyway, the lesson is that saint Paul does not say anyone is saved by faith alone and saint James does say that a chap is saved by works and not by faith alone. It is really pretty easy and completely consistent. Just avoid adding "alone" to what saint Paul says and remember that saint James says a person is saved by works and not by faith alone and you'll be right, mate.