Which side is your bread buttered?

[MoreCoffee]

Vote for tax cuts and watch what happens. ....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6niWzomA_So

 

[Lamb]

Care to give us a short version since this is an hour long video? I'm not sure why this is in the Politics forum...Obama was President when this was posted on YouTube 2013.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Care to give us a short version since this is an hour long video? I'm not sure why this is in the Politics forum...Obama was President when this was posted on YouTube 2013.

No

I reckon you can work it out if you think about it.

 

[tango]

Can't be bothered to watch a video that long.

Assuming the title isn't misleading, would you support a 100% tax rate? If tax cuts are inherently bad, are tax raises inherently good?

 

[Josiah]

I can understand why an Australian would think Americans should pay more taxes....... doesn't effect him.

I think Australians should be taxed at 100% and left penneyless ... and then reinburse every other country who has spent money to help that country - UK, US, etc.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Can't be bothered to watch a video that long.

Assuming the title isn't misleading, would you support a 100% tax rate? If tax cuts are inherently bad, are tax raises inherently good?

100% tax is unworkable isn't it and no one suggests it. But a marginal tax rate of 100% for income over, say, $4,000,000 might be useful. It would discourage excessive pay for company directors and excessive profit extraction for business owners. Business tax rates would need to be negotiated, if the business puts its profits to work in the community by paying good salaries and building infrastructure for public use (free of charge) then you'd want a lower tax rate and for businesses that do not do those things then a higher tax rate might be useful. But if you do not want to watch the video because it is an hour long ... how much time do you spend reading CH posts?

 

[tango]

100% tax is unworkable isn't it and no one suggests it. But a marginal tax rate of 100% for income over, say, $4,000,000 might be useful. It would discourage excessive pay for company directors and excessive profit extraction for business owners. Business tax rates would need to be negotiated, if the business puts its profits to work in the community by paying good salaries and building infrastructure for public use (free of charge) then you'd want a lower tax rate and for businesses that do not do those things then a higher tax rate might be useful. But if you do not want to watch the video because it is an hour long ... how much time do you spend reading CH posts?

Except it wouldn't, it would just encourage more creative ways to avoid paying it. Just like with every other tax that gets too intrusive for those it allegedly targets.

I rarely spend a solid hour reading CH posts. The issue isn't so much the hour as the expectation of sitting and dedicating a single solid hour to something that is unlikely to be of much interest to me. Perhaps I should simply be grateful that the government deigns to allow me to keep as much of the fruit of my labor as it does. Maybe I should be thankful for the silent partner that usually does little to support my business, does a lot to make it harder to make a living and takes a generous slice of everything I produce.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Except it wouldn't, it would just encourage more creative ways to avoid paying it. Just like with every other tax that gets too intrusive for those it allegedly targets.

I rarely spend a solid hour reading CH posts. The issue isn't so much the hour as the expectation of sitting and dedicating a single solid hour to something that is unlikely to be of much interest to me. Perhaps I should simply be grateful that the government deigns to allow me to keep as much of the fruit of my labor as it does. Maybe I should be thankful for the silent partner that usually does little to support my business, does a lot to make it harder to make a living and takes a generous slice of everything I produce.

You could also be thankful for the roads you drive on, the side walks you walk on the sewer system that takes away your unwanted wastes the garbage collection that takes away your trash the police the protect you the ambulances that take you to hospital when you're sick the hospitals that look after you when you're sick and so on. They are worthy things, as well as the communication systems you use, the military that guards your nation the border patrols that apprehend undocumented immigrants the civil service that handles foreign affairs and customs and quarantine and so on. Maybe those things are why taxes are needed. And the Midicaid and Medicare available to you the pensions paid and the coast guard and the centre for disease control and so on ... you could, in theory, opt out of all that by moving with your personal wealth to some country that doesn't provide those benefits nor extract any taxes. Something like that surely exists.

 

[psalms 91]

You could also be thankful for the roads you drive on, the side walks you walk on the sewer system that takes away your unwanted wastes the garbage collection that takes away your trash the police the protect you the ambulances that take you to hospital when you're sick the hospitals that look after you when you're sick and so on. They are worthy things, as well as the communication systems you use, the military that guards your nation the border patrols that apprehend undocumented immigrants the civil service that handles foreign affairs and customs and quarantine and so on. Maybe those things are why taxes are needed. And the Midicaid and Medicare available to you the pensions paid and the coast guard and the centre for disease control and so on ... you could, in theory, opt out of all that by moving with your personal wealth to some country that doesn't provide those benefits nor extract any taxes. Something like that surely exists.

Yes they do they are called third world or under developed countries that I am sure the rich would not want to live in, they would rather change this country and take away all the social programs so they can be benifitted. Look at Social Security, people paid into that alll their lives if they worked and of course in the past there was a surplus so the government raided the money available and now they are crying because it is going broke and of course they want to cut the benefits even though their own robbery created the problem. My reason for never voting Republican

 

[TurtleHare]

Yes they do they are called third world or under developed countries that I am sure the rich would not want to live in, they would rather change this country and take away all the social programs so they can be benifitted. Look at Social Security, people paid into that alll their lives if they worked and of course in the past there was a surplus so the government raided the money available and now they are crying because it is going broke and of course they want to cut the benefits even though their own robbery created the problem. My reason for never voting Republican

Now how can you be blaming the Republicans for social sec probs when it can be traced back to the Dems borrowing and dwindling it down, look at this 2011 forbes article for that proof https://www.forbes.com/sites/merril...lion-social-security-trust-fund/#4cc6a5514947

 

[psalms 91]

Now how can you be blaming the Republicans for social sec probs when it can be traced back to the Dems borrowing and dwindling it down, look at this 2011 forbes article for that proof https://www.forbes.com/sites/merril...lion-social-security-trust-fund/#4cc6a5514947

Both are to blame for that which is why I said the government but it is the Republicans that want to cut benefits rather than pay the money back

 

[tango]

You could also be thankful for the roads you drive on, the side walks you walk on the sewer system that takes away your unwanted wastes the garbage collection that takes away your trash the police the protect you the ambulances that take you to hospital when you're sick the hospitals that look after you when you're sick and so on. They are worthy things, as well as the communication systems you use, the military that guards your nation the border patrols that apprehend undocumented immigrants the civil service that handles foreign affairs and customs and quarantine and so on. Maybe those things are why taxes are needed. And the Midicaid and Medicare available to you the pensions paid and the coast guard and the centre for disease control and so on ... you could, in theory, opt out of all that by moving with your personal wealth to some country that doesn't provide those benefits nor extract any taxes. Something like that surely exists.

Ah yes, but now we're back to the balance between a good rate of tax and a bad rate of tax. A tax cut isn't inherently a bad thing. Some of the things you list above are provided by private enterprise in some areas, some things would probably be better if provided by private enterprise, especially when so many areas of government are known for profligate waste.

 

[tango]

Both are to blame for that which is why I said the government but it is the Republicans that want to cut benefits rather than pay the money back

Your earlier post was little more than a comment about government in general followed by a gripe at Republicans in particular. Do you really think the Democrats care about the little people any more than the Republicans do? Politicians represent the elite and the elite look after their own. If they throw more crumbs to the poor people the chances are it's because they want something. Most likely they want the poor people to be locked into voting for them forever, which is the kind of thing the so-called "affordable" care act does to the relatively poor self-employed. Throw enough government money at people, scare them into thinking the nasty other side will cut off the money if they get into power, and you've got yourself a handy vote base to leverage.

 

[psalms 91]

Your earlier post was little more than a comment about government in general followed by a gripe at Republicans in particular. Do you really think the Democrats care about the little people any more than the Republicans do? Politicians represent the elite and the elite look after their own. If they throw more crumbs to the poor people the chances are it's because they want something. Most likely they want the poor people to be locked into voting for them forever, which is the kind of thing the so-called "affordable" care act does to the relatively poor self-employed. Throw enough government money at people, scare them into thinking the nasty other side will cut off the money if they get into power, and you've got yourself a handy vote base to leverage.

If that were true you would have a point but the fact is that Republicans are against entitlement programs that help the poor. It is not scare tactics to say that they want to cut Social Security, it is fact

 

[Josiah]

I'd like to avoid the "Republican vs. Democrat" thing, but here's MY take


I'm in favor of HELPING those that need it. BUT you can't help people who don't want help (you CAN enable them to continue in their horrible situation, however). Enabling their bad situation is hurting them, not helping - although it may be exactly what they want.


I'm thinking of the old proverb, "Give a man a fish and you've fed him for a day, teach a man to fish and you've fed him for a lifetime." I'm passionately in favor of giving people opportunities, giving them a "HAND UP" (rather than just a hand out). I support quality education.... I support the excellent "Community Colleges" we have in California - they are everywhere, they are almost free, and they are FULL of great programs of all kinds that train people for real jobs with real salaries that need people to fill them. I'm in favor of scholarships to help them, even free child care at such colleges. All such, however, should be dependent upon them WANTING to do something about their situation. I'm opposed to the current reality where people can take classes at such colleges for decades, simply using the governement aid to be a perpetual student majoring in basket weaving now entering there 400th class in that, while on welfare, food stamps, subsidized housing, etc.


We have a not-for-profit agency in our town.... one our church helps support. It embraces people who are poor and without resoures and "stuck" - indeed, it is limited to those where there are children involved (it's a family thing - whether or not two adults are involved). BUT the people need to take drug tests..... they need to have left behind a life of crime (they can have a criminal record - even just released from prison)... and they need to submit to the rules. They are granted a NICE apartment with the rent being 25% of their take home pay (whatever that is), ulitities are subsidized. Free child care is provided, free aftter school care is provided. Even free mass transit is provided for those without cars. And free tuition is granted for the MANY job training programs - all for jobs that have a salary that can support a family in our area (where rents are absurdly high). They work with the community colleges, several government agencies and a large number of private businesses. They get counseling.... they learn about personal finances and economics.... they learn job interview skills.... etc. All free. YOU WOULD THINK they would have a list of people wanting to get into this program miles long! Nope. They have vacancies. They can't fill the openings they have. Folks don't like the drug tests..... people don't like the "one felony and you're out" policy... they don't like the rules and required classes.... they don't like having to take classes and work.... SOME do.... many don't.


You can't help those who don't want it. You CAN empower them to take that stance, but is that helping them?




.

 

[tango]

If that were true you would have a point but the fact is that Republicans are against entitlement programs that help the poor. It is not scare tactics to say that they want to cut Social Security, it is fact

Social Security isn't an entitlement program. Do you really think the Democrats hand out welfare to help the poor, or to keep the poor enslaved to Democrat policies?

 

[Josiah]

Social Security isn't an entitlement program. Do you really think the Democrats hand out welfare to help the poor, or to keep the poor enslaved to Democrat policies?

When you hand someone a fish a day, you create a dependent.... and if they vote, strengthen and continue your power.

 

[psalms 91]

Social Security isn't an entitlement program. Do you really think the Democrats hand out welfare to help the poor, or to keep the poor enslaved to Democrat policies?

I think that this is going away from my point which is that Republicans want to cut Social Security which as you say is nto entiitlement but rather something people worked and paid into so that is even worse wanting to cut something which they have earned

 

[Lamb]

I think the term "entitlement" depends on how you're defining it. If you feel you have paid into a program then you're entitled to reap the benefits...making it an entitlement.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Unemployment payments, Medicare, Medicaid, age pension, disability pension, use of roads, use of water, and such things is part of living in a western nation. It isn't an entitlement but it is a benefit that comes from living in a society that subscribes to western democratic ideals. I hope that such values - like feeding the hungry and housing the homeless - would be a human value practised by people and their elected governments all over the world though I know that right now it is not so.