Mother of God

[Lamb]

What about the title queen of Heaven?

I've never used that title. That's not what this thread is about.

 

[Josiah]

i would say you use the term here in a flippant nature ..right?

No. I ADORE my girlfriend. I ADORE fresh trout.



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[Brighten04]

I've never used that title. That's not what this thread is about.

I know, but, it was mentioned in this thread so, even though you(personally) have not used this title, my question is does the RCC call Mary the queen of Heaven. If someone could answer this question for me with a simple yes or no would be helpful.

 

[Lamb]

I know, but, it was mentioned in this thread so, even though you(personally) have not used this title, my question is does the RCC call Mary the queen of Heaven. If someone could answer this question for me with a simple yes or no would be helpful.

I'll start a new thread so as not to have a tangent on this one.
New thread HERE: http://christianityhaven.com/showth...y-quot-Queen-of-Heaven-quot&p=13929#post13929

 

[George]

Even though I'm Orthodox, I've never used the Queen of Heaven title because I'm not comfortable with it and it doesn't sit right with me at all. I only prefer to use Mother of God and Theotokos.

 

[charis en excelcis]

This seems to be a hugely controversial term for Mary, and I'm honestly not sure why.

So the controversy, in the end, is that many Protestants view the title as a form of idolatry.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Here's another off topic bit of help for the folk who have some odd notions of what adoration might mean; and a little history - the Catholic Church has been using the word 'adoratio' from a time long before the English language existed.

ADORATION is the acknowledgement of God as God, Creator and Saviour, the Lord and Master of everything that exists. Through worship and prayer, the Church and individual persons give to God the adoration which is the first act of the virtue of religion. The first commandment of the law obliges us to adore. (from the Glossary of the CCC)

Adoration is the act of religion by which God is recognized as alone worthy of supreme honor because he is infinitely perfect, has supreme dominion over humans, and the right to human total dependence on the Creator. It is at once an act of mind and will, expressing itself in appropriate prayers, postures of praise, and acts of reverence and sacrifice. (Etym. Latin ad- to + orare, to pray; or os, oris, mouth, from the pagan custom of expressing preference for a god by wafting a kiss to the statue: adoratio, worship, veneration.) (click this link for the source)

 

[MoreCoffee]

So the controversy, in the end, is that many Protestants view the title as a form of idolatry.

Many? Probably 'some' would be more accurate. The liturgical/magisterial Protestant denominations tend not to see it that way, though some Presbyterians may. Pentecostals are in the 'some' category sometimes but not always.

 

[charis en excelcis]

Many? Probably 'some' would be more accurate. The liturgical/magisterial Protestant denominations tend not to see it that way, though some Presbyterians may. Pentecostals are in the 'some' category sometimes but not always.

Pentecostals are the largest Protestant group, so that alone qualifies as many. In addition you will find that Baptists feel this almost universally. I believe that as a Pentecostal, I have a clear idea what they would believe, just as you might have a clear view of Catholicism.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Pentecostals are the largest Protestant group, so that alone qualifies as many. In addition you will find that Baptists feel this almost universally. I believe that as a Pentecostal, I have a clear idea what they would believe, just as you might have a clear view of Catholicism.

I am not sure that your claim is correct. There are lots of people who say they are 'charismatic' but that's not pentecostal.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The words in the "hail Mary" are mostly from holy scripture. You can find them in Luke chapter one and even though some additions are present in the suppliant part of the prayer they are in keeping with scriptural themes.

Hail Mary, full of grace. (Luke 1:28)
Our Lord is with thee. (Luke 1:28)
Blessed art thou among women, (Luke 1:42)
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, (Luke 1:42)
Jesus. (The name of God the Son while incarnate on Earth and now in the heavens)
Holy Mary, Mother of God, (Luke 3:23, 38)
pray for us sinners, (Colossiand 4:3)
now and at the hour of our death. (a good time for prayers)
Amen. (a word found in holy scripture and meaning "truly")

 

[charis en excelcis]

I am not sure that your claim is correct. There are lots of people who say they are 'charismatic' but that's not pentecostal.

Our fellowship alone worldwide is 67 billion. The cooperative agreements would put the figure above 200 million. So I think that we can safely say many.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Our fellowship alone worldwide is 67 billion. The cooperative agreements would put the figure above 200 million. So I think that we can safely say many.

There are only 7.3 billion people in the whole world; your stated claim of 67 billion must be a typo.

 

[charis en excelcis]

There are only 7 billion people in the whole world; your stated claim of 67 billion must be a typo.

LOL. Unless you count those offplanet.

 

[MoreCoffee]

A great many of our Catholic songs and prayers invoke Blessed Mary as intercessor who we ask to pray for us and present our hopes, desires, and dreams to the Lord our God.

 

[Alithis]

The words in the "hail Mary" are mostly from holy scripture. You can find them in Luke chapter one and even though some additions are present in the suppliant part of the prayer they are in keeping with scriptural themes.

Hail Mary, full of grace. (Luke 1:28)
Our Lord is with thee. (Luke 1:28)
Blessed art thou among women, (Luke 1:42)
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, (Luke 1:42)
Jesus. (The name of God the Son while incarnate on Earth and now in the heavens)
Holy Mary, Mother of God, (Luke 3:23, 38)
pray for us sinners, (Colossiand 4:3)
now and at the hour of our death. (a good time for prayers)
Amen. (a word found in holy scripture and meaning "truly")

there it is again ... that inane drive to pursue the glorification of mary .always trying to lift her always trying to elevate her always bringing her to mind ,holding her ever before your eyes and thoughts .
these actions are worshipful they are acts of worship.

the lord JESUS is the ONLY one worthy of such constant devotion and praise ..

oh but we venerate they say not worship.. - but your actions speak louder the your words .you promote mary far more than you even give the LOrd jesus ..the king of all kings and lord of all lords , mention.
and why ? when the bible NEVER TELLS US TO ? why? because rome tells you to in opposition to the bible . and you know it now . you know you must chose this day whom you will serve . because you cannot follow the lord JEsus and rome -you must forsake one to bow down to the other .

 

[MoreCoffee]

We sing of Christ as saviour of the world and Mary as his blessed mother who also pleads with us to recognise him who came from heaven to redeem his prople

 

[popsthebuilder]

Perhaps some history will help. "Venerate" is derived from Latin and its use in the Catholic Church predates the invention of the English language. It is not the Church redefining a word it is the English language evolving into different meanings of old words that that have a history far longer and more ancient than the English language.

Just to be clear; a lot of that ancient history is of pagan persuasion, and in the very least polytheism among other things.

Faith in selfless Unity for Good.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Just to be clear; a lot of that ancient history is of pagan persuasion, and in the very least polytheism among other things.

Faith in selfless Unity for Good.

Just to be clear - the Catholic Church existed before there was an English language.

 

[popsthebuilder]

To say that God(Jesus) was GOD the father while he was of the flesh is inaccurate. His mother of flesh implies his submitance under the father. As does the fact that he cried out to GOD upon his death. Do you really think he was inquiring of himself. Not to mention all through the bible is praises God The father and created specifically Through Christ, not as Christ. Christ is the way, God is the destination. Mary, being of the flesh and wholly subsidiary of God in her prayer and words further deny her of being a literal equal of God.

Faith in selfless Unity for Good.