When is our name written in the book of life?

[RichWh1]

The all is not "all mankind." If it was, then God would be weaker than men.
The all is "all the chosen, elect, people." Not one person whom God chooses will be left unsaved. God's will is absolutely and sovereignly accomplished.
Free-will philosophy is a worldly and ungodly teaching from humans who demand control over God's actions.

All has to include everyone because of the words of Jesus in John 3 For God so loved the world (not just the elect) that He gave His only Son that whoever believes in Him might not perish but have eternal life


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[psalms 91]

True, but I have passages of scripture, in context, to backup my assertions on this topic. The scriptures are not unclear.
Free-will is a man-made philosophy. You cannot find it being taught in the Bible. You have to pluck a few sentences, out of context, to build a free-will argument. I'll trust the text of scripture over man-made reasoning and philosophy.

Nope what you did is added to scripture it says all it doesnt qualify it at all to say those whom I chose it just says all.

 

[davedajobauk]

Some ADDED presumptions amongst that reply (?) ~perhaps a Google search
would give you a more concise meaning for, 'Free Choice'
Exactly as I said (I disagree, your one-answer covers-all)

?

Without Free Will, mankind could not CHOOSE, to follow Jesus or, take an alternative path


You are being too-literal in your understanding (of text), is my view
Allow the Spirit to light your way :thumbsup:

dave

 

[davedajobauk]

Dave I would suggest you research when the bible was written and how old ancient scrolls are that contain the text, you may get a surprise

Please, please, please_ re-read my post
I did not refer-to the original scriptures [manuscripts]

I did research The writing of the Christian Bible_ the dates I provided, are well-established
I did not make reference to the OT, which (more or less) came direct from the Torah

Please be assured of my taking-pains to be 'accurate'

dave

 

[davedajobauk]

Sorry, dave, but your assertions are thoroughly incorrect and thus you struggle.

Before we get to, the NT VERSIONS

You may believe whatever you wish, but I am well-aware of the resistance that folks will have to overcome
~to accept, that the words, in which they have grown to believe and have faith in
WERE actually "WRITTEN BY MEN" specifically, Jewish Scholars
and *that ONLY the original texts (manuscripts) will have been "Heavenly-Inspired"



According to JEWISH PEOPLE_ who were asked the question "Who is Jesus ?"

reply: "He was a Jew, who departed Judaism to become King of the Christians"

The Quran assumes familiarity with major narratives recounted in the Biblical scriptures. It summarizes some, dwells at length on others and, in some cases, presents alternative accounts and interpretations of events.[15][16][17] The Quran describes itself as a book of guidance for mankind 2:185. It sometimes offers detailed accounts of specific historical events, and it often emphasizes the moral significance of an event over its narrative sequence.[18][19] Hadith are additional oral and written traditions supplementing the Quran; from careful authentication they are believed to describe words and actions of Muhammad, and in some traditions also those closest to him.[20] In most denominations of Islam, the Quran is used together with hadith to interpret sharia (Islamic) law;[20] in a small number of denominations, only the Quran is used as a source. During prayers, the Quran is recited only in Arabic.[21]

source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quran

Shariah is the law of the Qur’an and literally means “A path to life giving water.”
In fact, the word Yarrah (i.e. the root of the Hebrew word Torah) means precisely the same thing.
Therefore, Shariah is actually ingrained in Abrahamic tradition.

The Jewish people and the Palestinians are ALL ARABS (?)

The "MISSING TRIBES" ? were tracked via DNA profiling. They, emigrated to Europe.... many turning, from Judaism
The Nazis (?) were, it seems into 'Ethnic Cleansing' of a rival tribe

While there was some effort made, to bring the "warring tribes" together under 'governorships'
there is NO archaeological EVIDENCE (record) of, the existence of, a Jewish "NATION"
before 1948

_ 1948
At midnight on May 14, 1948, the Provisional Government of Israel proclaimed a new State of Israel. On that same date, the United States, in the person of President Truman, recognized the provisional Jewish government as de facto authority of the Jewish state (de jure recognition was extended on January 31, 1949).15 Aug 2016
U.S. Recognition of the State of Israel | National Archives
https://www.archives.gov/education/lessons/us-israel

dave


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I signed-in again and pressed the back-button several times, to find the above text was still hanging-in, unsubmitted and intact \o/

 

[davedajobauk]

So, and I say this in full-belief that this is so

Jewish people wrote all or most of the major religious texts
I note, their differences :thumbsup:

an open-question could-be ? "WHY ?"



an answer ?

Take good note of the second paragraph

http://www.differencebetween.net/miscellaneous/difference-between-zionism-and-judaism/


Actually I am posting the 'third paragraph' here
[emboldening - mine]
¬

Judaism as a religion is really a simple way of life, where man lives his life quietly and with dignity, while observing
the traditional Jewish rituals that are ordained in the Torah. Zionism on the other hand speaks of the exclusivity of the Jews
their right on the holy land, the acquisition and conquest of lands held by other people, which is rightly their own.
As opposed to a practitioner of Judaism, for whom a Jew is a person who believes in God, and strives to carry out his word
as passed down to him in the Torah. He does not think in terms of the lineage of a Jewish race which is separate from that of the others.

In future posts, I will make the distinction, between Jews (as a whole) and Zionists.

 

[MennoSota]

Before we get to, the NT VERSIONS

You may believe whatever you wish, but I am well-aware of the resistance that folks will have ~to accept
that the words, in which they have grown to believe and have faith in
WERE
"WRITTEN BY MEN" specifically, Jewish Scholars and *that ONLY the original texts (manuscripts) will have been "Heavenly-Inspired"



According to JEWISH PEOPLE_ who were asked the question "Who is Jesus ?"

reply: "He was a Jew, who departed Judaism to become King of the Christians"



source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quran



The Jewish people and the Palestinians are ALL ARABS (?)

The "MISSING TRIBES" ? were tracked via DNA profiling. They, emigrated to Europe.... many turning, from Judaism
The Nazis (?) were, it seems into 'Ethnic Cleansing' of a rival tribe

While there was some effort made, to bring the "warring tribes" together under 'governorships'
there is NO archaeological EVIDENCE (record) of, the existence of, a Jewish "NATION"
before 1948

_ 1948
At midnight on May 14, 1948, the Provisional Government of Israel proclaimed a new State of Israel. On that same date, the United States, in the person of President Truman, recognized the provisional Jewish government as de facto authority of the Jewish state (de jure recognition was extended on January 31, 1949).15 Aug 2016
U.S. Recognition of the State of Israel | National Archives
https://www.archives.gov/education/lessons/us-israel

dave


Strangely, I thought this post to be LOST, when this popped-up¬
vBulletin Message


vBulletin Message
Your submission could not be processed because a security token was missing.

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Christianity Haven
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I signed-in again and pressed the back-button several times, to find the above text was still hanging-in, unsubmitted and intact \o/

You are entirely wrong, dave. Your information is from illegitimate and worthless sources.

 

[davedajobauk]

You are entirely wrong, dave. Your information is from illegitimate and worthless sources.

Walk in my shoes for a while_

Many are given eyes but do not / WILL-NOT 'see'


There is (or was) no JEWISH RACE … no NATION OF JEWS... until 1948

~They fought and robbed each other as tribes

You have access to material that explains the reason-for The Exodus ?
Will you not find a similar 'reason' for why the Germans wanted-rid ? [of Zionists, probably]


You are entitled to your opinion..

I write and copy these 'informations' here
~in the full and certain knowledge, that God is watching 'ME'
rayer:


dave


ETA: Zionism, may well have given birth to Facism… their behaviours can be PAIRED
fascism
[ˈfaʃɪz(ə)m]

NOUN
an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
synonyms: authoritarianism · totalitarianism · dictatorship · despotism · autocracy · absolute rule · Nazism
· rightism · militarism · nationalism · xenophobia · racism · anti-Semitism · [More]
(in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practices.

 

[davedajobauk]

fascism for Students
: a political system headed by a dictator in which the government controls business and labor and opposition is not permitted



Hasn't this fellow already taken steps, to ensure his TERM doesn't end ?

The current Prime Minister is Benjamin Netanyahu of Likud , the ninth person to hold the position (excluding caretakers).
Following an election, the President nominates a member of the Knesset to become Prime Minister after asking party leaders
whom they support for the position. The nominee then presents a government platform
and must receive a vote of confidence in order to become Prime Minister. _Prime Minister of Israel - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Minister_of_Israel


Israel · President
Reuven Rivlin

 

[MennoSota]

Walk in my shoes for a while_

Many are given eyes but do not / WILL-NOT 'see'


There is (or was) no JEWISH RACE … no NATION OF JEWS... until 1948

~They fought and robbed each other as tribes

You have access to material that explains the reason-for The Exodus ?
Will you not find a similar 'reason' for why the Germans wanted-rid ? [of Zionists, probably]


You are entitled to your opinion..

I write and copy these 'informations' here
~in the full and certain knowledge, that God is watching 'ME'
rayer:


dave


ETA: Zionism, may well have given birth to Facism… their behaviours can be PAIRED
fascism
[ˈfaʃɪz(ə)m]

NOUN
an authoritarian and nationalistic right-wing system of government and social organization.
synonyms: authoritarianism · totalitarianism · dictatorship · despotism · autocracy · absolute rule · Nazism
· rightism · militarism · nationalism · xenophobia · racism · anti-Semitism · [More]
(in general use) extreme right-wing, authoritarian, or intolerant views or practices.

Dave, you make no sense.

 

[davedajobauk]

I am grateful for all those blank pages I have yet to cause to be written

:amen:

 

[davedajobauk]

The Masoretes wrote nothing of the new testament.

I NEVER SAID THEY DID_ Please be careful when reading my posts
¬
It would appear that you are attempting to discount everything that doesn't align with your thinking


The Masoretic Texts, would have been accessed (perhaps) as 'reference material'
[reason-for, my mentioning] as NT was still being compiled ^ ie: KJV _@ 1500's AD

just saying

dave

 

[atpollard]

Choice we are given_ thus "Free Will" is implicitly given, even-when, it goes unsaid

Matthew 25:33
33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

Except a sheep is never given the choice to be a sheep or a goat. A sheep is born a sheep and a goat is born a goat. It is based on genetics.

 

[atpollard]

Without Free Will, mankind could not CHOOSE, to follow Jesus or, take an alternative path

According to scripture, mankind does not choose. God chooses.

[John 6:70 NASB] 70 Jesus answered them, "Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and [yet] one of you is a devil?"
[John 15:16 NASB] 16 "You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and [that] your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.
[James 2:5 NASB] 5 Listen, my beloved brethren: did not God choose the poor of this world [to be] rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him?

Perhaps that is because:

[Romans 3:10-11 NASB] 10 as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; 11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;
[1 Corinthians 1:18 NASB] 18 For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
[1 Corinthians 2:14 NASB] 14 But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.
[2 Corinthians 4:3-4 NASB] 3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

 

[MoreCoffee]

According to scripture, mankind does not choose. God chooses.

[John 6:70 NASB] 70 Jesus answered them, "Did I Myself not choose you, the twelve, and [yet] one of you is a devil?"
[John 15:16 NASB] 16 "You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and [that] your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask of the Father in My name He may give to you.
[James 2:5 NASB] 5 Listen, my beloved brethren: did not God choose the poor of this world [to be] rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him?

Perhaps that is because:

[Romans 3:10-11 NASB] 10 as it is written, "THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; 11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD;
[1 Corinthians 1:18 NASB] 18 For the word of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.
[1 Corinthians 2:14 NASB] 14 But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.
[2 Corinthians 4:3-4 NASB] 3 And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, 4 in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.

Lovely verses but isn't the first one applicable to the 12 disciples at the time when Jesus was still on the earth?

And isn't James 2:5 about a class of people rather than about individuals? "The poor of this world" looks like a group rather than individuals as would be the case if it was written as "did not God choose some among the poor of the world"

Maybe God's choosing is not so much about individuals each being predestined to eternal life as it is about God choosing classes of people according to the statements in the holy scriptures like the one in James 2:5.

 

[TangledWeb]

Lovely verses but isn't the first one applicable to the 12 disciples at the time when Jesus was still on the earth?

And isn't James 2:5 about a class of people rather than about individuals? "The poor of this world" looks like a group rather than individuals as would be the case if it was written as "did not God choose some among the poor of the world"

Maybe God's choosing is not so much about individuals each being predestined to eternal life as it is about God choosing classes of people according to the statements in the holy scriptures like the one in James 2:5.

Would that not be then our names written in the book of life because of what we do instead of Him? That doesn't sound right.

 

[atpollard]

Lovely verses but isn't the first one applicable to the 12 disciples at the time when Jesus was still on the earth?

Yes. GOD chose the 12 disciples. Even when it appears that several decided to follow Jesus as their own choice, Jesus makes it clear that Jesus (God incarnate) chose them and not the other way around.

And isn't James 2:5 about a class of people rather than about individuals? "The poor of this world" looks like a group rather than individuals as would be the case if it was written as "did not God choose some among the poor of the world"

Maybe God's choosing is not so much about individuals each being predestined to eternal life as it is about God choosing classes of people according to the statements in the holy scriptures like the one in James 2:5.

Umm ... what does it say God chose the poor for?
“to be rich in faith” (you can look up what scripture says about faith if you want) ... and “heirs of the kingdom” (doesn’t that mean saved?).

So why don’t you properly refute me by presenting all of the verses that say a man chose God rather than God chose a man.

 

[davedajobauk]

It is based on genetics.

and Whose PLAN is that ?

case in point: _"His thoughts, are higher than our thoughts"

 

[davedajobauk]

According to scripture, mankind does not choose. God chooses.

But surely I wrote: Originally Posted by davedajobauk
"Without Free Will, mankind could not CHOOSE, to follow Jesus or, take an alternative path"

iow: ~not to-follow Jesus

rhetorical question:
Does God 'also choose' (?) those, whom will not (in good-time) repent

 

[davedajobauk]

"God, never does anything imperfectly"

Let the Holy Spirit translate for you


I used-to believe in the Holy Bible
I recognised, that the language [used] was 'archaic'
indeed, it sounds like our languages have come a long way since 'those-days'

I found the Bible becoming more and more a collection (anthology) of 'statements'
that when read 'literally' [against the background of archaeology] made less and less 'sense'
~that God could mean (intend-]to have [such] passed-on [/passed-down] to us


Now, I do not claim to know God's intentions for the people of Earth
(back then or now)
But I do know The FIGURES 'do not compute'_
God is LOVE ?
God is FORGIVING
God is MERCIFUL
God is beyond the EQUAL of any creature, that He has made
God doesn't do anything IMPERFECTLY
cue: stillborn, hopelessly-deformed, disaster victims, murder and rape victims, the victims of war and civil unrest
I won't ask, if He was 'punishing' those who suffered loss of friends / relatives (family)
for I believe those 'lost' were the victims of MEN doing satanic things and bad choices

So, I await with a kind of excitement and, near bated-breath
~for MANKIND to build a moon base
and to use that, as a 'stepping stone' into the remainder of the Solar System

IF, our planet were not surrounded by an electric fence (to keep us and Satan on-world)
You see, the Van Allen Belts are situated, in such a way
that there is no route into the solar system that may avoid-contact with them
except by the LONGER ROUTE ie: exiting Earth orbit, via Earth's 'poles'
and the solar system being-arranged as it is, this-means we cannot reach the elliptical plane
unless, we find some-way to SWIM out-there, instead-of going into 'free fall'


I have been having 'dreams' concerning our 'being-here' on-Earth (?)
as in ~CAST OUT OF HEAVEN along with Satan, who 'fearful' of our gaining knowledge
of him and becoming educated 'sufficiently' to defeat him/ or, of our then repenting
and returning to Heaven, that Satan had our genomes 'altered'
~our God-made PERFECT BODIES
were made susceptible to disease and the agues of ageing
where BEFORE, we might, have had 'abilities' such as, the 'AXOLOTL'
SATAN's PURPOSE, would then PERHAPS, be, to prevent sufficient knowledge being-obtained
as-might during such increased longevity (acquiring TRUTH) lead us to unseat Satan as ALL POWERFUL
yet unseen Ruler, of Hell on Earth [ENEMY of LOVE]

Failing to recognize FACT, when in-fact, it is 'hidden' in plain sight ~is, a human failing

dave