church growth

[NewCreation435]

I found this interesting article about church growth. it says.

"One of the most frequent questions asked is “What is the average growth rate of a church?” Eighty percent of the churches in America are not growing, and eight churches a day close in the United States and Canada. The most recent Annual Church Profiles for Southern Baptist churches in my home state of Florida reflect mostly declines, while some fourteen percent did not report any numbers at all. According to the Yearbook of American and Canadian Churches, the Southern Baptist Convention reported 16,160,088 members for a decline of nearly half a percent (.42%).

These numbers we count are much more than statistics and tools--each number represents a person God knows, loves, and desires to have a relationship with. They also represent people missing out on that relationship with Jesus Christ.

Growth rates are an important part of the diagnostic tools we have in our church growth toolbox here at MyChurchGrowth.com (Church Growth Associates), and I am going to show you how to figure your AGR. Part of developing your church growth strategies will be understanding growth rates. The AGR, (Annual Growth Rate) AAGR, (Average Annual Growth Rate) and DGR (Decadal Growth Rate) are all part of finding out “what” happened, and you should know, but we also need to find the “why” and “how” of it all.

How much growth does it take to grow a church? In church growth terms, a church is not growing unless it increases by five percent a year. On the other side, a church is not in a decline unless it is losing five percent a year. Everything in that ten percent window (five percent plus–and five percent minus) is considered a plateau.

What is the average worship attendance on any given Sunday for the churches in America? The median church in America has 75 in worship on any given Sunday morning, while less than half a percent become a megachurch (a megachurch is a congregation with at least 2,000 people attending worship on Sunday) and only 16% of megachurches have over 5000 in attendance. The chart included in the video at the top of this page shows how it breaks down."

the rest of the article is here
http://www.mychurchgrowth.com/church growth/agr.php

 

[meluckycharms]

I found this interesting article about church growth. it says.

"One of the most frequent questions asked is “What is the average growth rate of a church?” Eighty percent of the churches in America are not growing, and eight churches a day close in the United States and Canada. The most recent Annual Church Profiles for Southern Baptist churches in my home state of Florida reflect mostly declines, while some fourteen percent did not report any numbers at all. According to the Yearbook of American and Canadian Churches, the Southern Baptist Convention reported 16,160,088 members for a decline of nearly half a percent (.42%).

These numbers we count are much more than statistics and tools--each number represents a person God knows, loves, and desires to have a relationship with. They also represent people missing out on that relationship with Jesus Christ.

Growth rates are an important part of the diagnostic tools we have in our church growth toolbox here at MyChurchGrowth.com (Church Growth Associates), and I am going to show you how to figure your AGR. Part of developing your church growth strategies will be understanding growth rates. The AGR, (Annual Growth Rate) AAGR, (Average Annual Growth Rate) and DGR (Decadal Growth Rate) are all part of finding out “what” happened, and you should know, but we also need to find the “why” and “how” of it all.

How much growth does it take to grow a church? In church growth terms, a church is not growing unless it increases by five percent a year. On the other side, a church is not in a decline unless it is losing five percent a year. Everything in that ten percent window (five percent plus–and five percent minus) is considered a plateau.

What is the average worship attendance on any given Sunday for the churches in America? The median church in America has 75 in worship on any given Sunday morning, while less than half a percent become a megachurch (a megachurch is a congregation with at least 2,000 people attending worship on Sunday) and only 16% of megachurches have over 5000 in attendance. The chart included in the video at the top of this page shows how it breaks down."

the rest of the article is here
http://www.mychurchgrowth.com/church growth/agr.php

Well, given the fact that Christianity as a whole is in decline in the United States, it would only make sense that churches across the country would be in decline as well.

 

[Josiah]

I found this interesting article about church growth. it says.

"One of the most frequent questions asked is “What is the average growth rate of a church?” Eighty percent of the churches in America are not growing, and eight churches a day close in the United States and Canada. The most recent Annual Church Profiles for Southern Baptist churches in my home state of Florida reflect mostly declines, while some fourteen percent did not report any numbers at all. According to the Yearbook of American and Canadian Churches, the Southern Baptist Convention reported 16,160,088 members for a decline of nearly half a percent (.42%).

These numbers we count are much more than statistics and tools--each number represents a person God knows, loves, and desires to have a relationship with. They also represent people missing out on that relationship with Jesus Christ.

Growth rates are an important part of the diagnostic tools we have in our church growth toolbox here at MyChurchGrowth.com (Church Growth Associates), and I am going to show you how to figure your AGR. Part of developing your church growth strategies will be understanding growth rates. The AGR, (Annual Growth Rate) AAGR, (Average Annual Growth Rate) and DGR (Decadal Growth Rate) are all part of finding out “what” happened, and you should know, but we also need to find the “why” and “how” of it all.

How much growth does it take to grow a church? In church growth terms, a church is not growing unless it increases by five percent a year. On the other side, a church is not in a decline unless it is losing five percent a year. Everything in that ten percent window (five percent plus–and five percent minus) is considered a plateau.

What is the average worship attendance on any given Sunday for the churches in America? The median church in America has 75 in worship on any given Sunday morning, while less than half a percent become a megachurch (a megachurch is a congregation with at least 2,000 people attending worship on Sunday) and only 16% of megachurches have over 5000 in attendance. The chart included in the video at the top of this page shows how it breaks down."

the rest of the article is here
http://www.mychurchgrowth.com/church growth/agr.php

Some thoughts.....


1. Although there are certainly exceptions, it seems undeniable that church attendance/membership is in sharp decline - in some areas and denominations more than others. I'm not SURE this is the same thing as a decline in Christianity or Christian faith but I suspect so. Denials of this remind me of Ostriches burying their heads in the sand. The second largest religious group in the USA is FORMER Catholics, some 30 MILLION + in number. But nearly all denominations are bleeding....


2. I think institutions tends to defend the institution. And I think this principle is often at work here.... churches and denominations trying to keep the institution alive rather than do ministry, rather than lifting high the Cross. Sadly, Jesus is often forgotten.... the Great Commission and Great Commandment either forgotten or seen simply as a tool to put butts in the seats and money in the coffers to keep the institution alive. IMO, institutionalism may well be "killing" (hyperbole) the church even more than the cultural shift in this post-Christian age. But MY experience is this is imply what institutions do: they have a profound, powerful drive to stay alive. I struggle with this in my own ministry as Chairman of the Trustees - the folks who keep the facilities looking and working good.


3. I think we need to focus a lot more on love.... "By this will all the world know you are My disciples, if you have love for one another." "Love just as I have first loved you." I don't think that Christianity and Christians are widely thought of as "loving." But that SHOULD be the #1 thing that immediately springs to the minds of the unbelievers and unchurched. It requires quite a paradigm shift from our ever-increasing "consumer" mentality and uber-individualism: love requires swimming against a very, very strong tide of "what's in it for me?"


4. I think the Holy Spirit uses not only our love but our message. The uber-relativatism in modern Christianity means we've lost our voice, we simply have nothing to say. More and more churches and denominations have drifted from from orthodoxy to liberalism to nothing-ism. We have two HUGE mega churches in my area - neither has anything of a statement of faith, neither has any real theology, neither has a voice (just lots of busy activities and LOUD music). The church has largely lost its' voice, lost the Gospel. There ARE a (too few) people drawn to churches like the LCMS and RCC and some others that are "hold outs" that still proclaim the message (at least as they understand it) - boldly and unapologetically. But they are fewer and fewer.... and I have to admit, aren't growing (people are more attracted to the praise bands and youth groups and programs of the mega non-denoms that have no message so as to no offend or "bother" anyone). But I'm a hold out..... I believe (in spite of the evidence, I confess) that ultimately, the Holy Spirit will use the Gospel Message. We can't loose our voice and follow the crowd to a watered-down-to-nothing post modern "Christianity." IMO, the world isn't killing the Gospel.... Christians are loosing their voice.



Lord, have mercy..

Holy Spirit, fall upon us....


- Josiah

 

[tango]

I think it's also true to say that a large part of what is considered "Christianity" is actually little more than the people who go to church on a Sunday as a result of social convention rather than any particular desire to take up their cross and follow Jesus Christ. Now it's increasingly not only socially acceptable to not go to church on Sunday, but increasingly being regarded as an association with those "backward, hateful, bigoted Christians" it's hard to be surprised at people who were little more than nominal Christians deciding to stop attending church. In the UK it always used to be that whenever a form asked for someone's religion the standard answer was "Church of England" even if the last time the person ever darkened the door of a church was at their wedding. It was often asked what the Church of England did to deserve all these people claiming allegiance without ever lifting a finger to show allegiance.

Another phenomenon, following on from what Josiah said about the mega-churches, is the tendency within some groups to look to poach Christians from existing churches rather than doing the dirty work of going into the world and making new ones. Throw in the "candy-coated gospel" people want to hear and it's hardly surprising that the more nominal Christians will drift to a place that is little more than a social club that may happen to mention Jesus but only in the context of how much he loves everybody and everybody is just fine the way they are.

Sadly one other thing that helps keep churches small is when they end up with a very vocal group who is more interested in their hobby horse than spreading the gospel. I remember being in one church where it seemed there was a specific faction who didn't really care what the minister preached as long as he was resolute in condemning homosexuality. In fairness I wasn't at the church long enough to see just how big an issue it was - I was only visiting it a couple of times while on vacation - but it was enough to make me think I probably wouldn't stay in the church if it were my local one. I can only imagine how it would have appeared to someone who was struggling with homosexual desires, if nobody cared about much of anything other than making sure that YOU don't get to take part in it.

 

[Lamb]

God is the one who is growing His church. He sometimes lets attendance dwindle (think of the Old Testament where Israel kept turning away and God would then turn them back to Him).

 

[NewCreation435]

Some thoughts.....


1. Although there are certainly exceptions, it seems undeniable that church attendance/membership is in sharp decline - in some areas and denominations more than others. I'm not SURE this is the same thing as a decline in Christianity or Christian faith but I suspect so. Denials of this remind me of Ostriches burying their heads in the sand. The second largest religious group in the USA is FORMER Catholics, some 30 MILLION + in number. But nearly all denominations are bleeding....


2. I think institutions tends to defend the institution. And I think this principle is often at work here.... churches and denominations trying to keep the institution alive rather than do ministry, rather than lifting high the Cross. Sadly, Jesus is often forgotten.... the Great Commission and Great Commandment either forgotten or seen simply as a tool to put butts in the seats and money in the coffers to keep the institution alive. IMO, institutionalism may well be "killing" (hyperbole) the church even more than the cultural shift in this post-Christian age. But MY experience is this is imply what institutions do: they have a profound, powerful drive to stay alive. I struggle with this in my own ministry as Chairman of the Trustees - the folks who keep the facilities looking and working good.


3. I think we need to focus a lot more on love.... "By this will all the world know you are My disciples, if you have love for one another." "Love just as I have first loved you." I don't think that Christianity and Christians are widely thought of as "loving." But that SHOULD be the #1 thing that immediately springs to the minds of the unbelievers and unchurched. It requires quite a paradigm shift from our ever-increasing "consumer" mentality and uber-individualism: love requires swimming against a very, very strong tide of "what's in it for me?"


4. I think the Holy Spirit uses not only our love but our message. The uber-relativatism in modern Christianity means we've lost our voice, we simply have nothing to say. More and more churches and denominations have drifted from from orthodoxy to liberalism to nothing-ism. We have two HUGE mega churches in my area - neither has anything of a statement of faith, neither has any real theology, neither has a voice (just lots of busy activities and LOUD music). The church has largely lost its' voice, lost the Gospel. There ARE a (too few) people drawn to churches like the LCMS and RCC and some others that are "hold outs" that still proclaim the message (at least as they understand it) - boldly and unapologetically. But they are fewer and fewer.... and I have to admit, aren't growing (people are more attracted to the praise bands and youth groups and programs of the mega non-denoms that have no message so as to no offend or "bother" anyone). But I'm a hold out..... I believe (in spite of the evidence, I confess) that ultimately, the Holy Spirit will use the Gospel Message. We can't loose our voice and follow the crowd to a watered-down-to-nothing post modern "Christianity." IMO, the world isn't killing the Gospel.... Christians are loosing their voice.



Lord, have mercy..

Holy Spirit, fall upon us....


- Josiah

I completely agree that the church should be known more for being loving and caring for others and often is not. I have experienced more judgment and critical attitudes from those in the church than those outside of it

 

[Albion]

It depends a lot on what it is that they are judging, doesn't it?

 

[NewCreation435]

It depends a lot on what it is that they are judging, doesn't it?

yes, it does. most of the time it seems to be very petty, childish judging that isn't warranted, but that's just my opinion

 

[MennoSota]

What do we mean by the term "church?"
God's church is exactly as big as God has ordained and chosen it to be. The meeting places and number of true church members going to that particular meeting place will fluctuate because of many reasons. Some could be due to unrepentant sin in that meeting. Others could be due to relocation or finding another group that is more enjoyable.
If a true church member goes to another meeting place and is walking in step with the Holy Spirit, I hold no grudge against her/his choice. May God bless you.
The thing is, many meetings are filled with people who are not yet a part of God's family. They may make an external claim, but God has not yet given them the gift of grace. Such people often will jump around from church to church, seeking to find someone who will tell them what they want to hear rather than have someone say "thus sayeth the Lord."

 

[NewCreation435]

What do we mean by the term "church?"
God's church is exactly as big as God has ordained and chosen it to be. The meeting places and number of true church members going to that particular meeting place will fluctuate because of many reasons. Some could be due to unrepentant sin in that meeting. Others could be due to relocation or finding another group that is more enjoyable.
If a true church member goes to another meeting place and is walking in step with the Holy Spirit, I hold no grudge against her/his choice. May God bless you.
The thing is, many meetings are filled with people who are not yet a part of God's family. They may make an external claim, but God has not yet given them the gift of grace. Such people often will jump around from church to church, seeking to find someone who will tell them what they want to hear rather than have someone say "thus sayeth the Lord."

I agree with most of what you said except for the phrase you used "God's church is exactly as big as God has ordained and chosen it to be." An example I would use is the people of God in the Old Testament represented by the people of Israel. Often we see the people of God there suffering because of their own disobedience and as a result experiencing persecution from groups like the Philistines and Babylon and Assyria. God is often telling them to repent, so that He can bless them. But, God doesn't bless disobedience, so the people of God ended up missing out on what He wanted for them. They didn't experience His blessings in many cases just as believers today don't because they are walking in known disobedience and sin. And it is out of character for God to bless someone when they are knowingly walking in disobedience

 

[MennoSota]

I agree with most of what you said except for the phrase you used "God's church is exactly as big as God has ordained and chosen it to be." An example I would use is the people of God in the Old Testament represented by the people of Israel. Often we see the people of God there suffering because of their own disobedience and as a result experiencing persecution from groups like the Philistines and Babylon and Assyria. God is often telling them to repent, so that He can bless them. But, God doesn't bless disobedience, so the people of God ended up missing out on what He wanted for them. They didn't experience His blessings in many cases just as believers today don't because they are walking in known disobedience and sin. And it is out of character for God to bless someone when they are knowingly walking in disobedience

I don't see how anything you wrote changes my comment.
"God's church is exactly as big as God has ordained and chosen it to be."
The example you use is a part of the Mosaic Covenant. Is the New Covenant corporate in nature?

 

[NewCreation435]

I don't see how anything you wrote changes my comment.
"God's church is exactly as big as God has ordained and chosen it to be."
The example you use is a part of the Mosaic Covenant. Is the New Covenant corporate in nature?

I guess that depends on what you mean by corporate. I do believe that local churches can displease God by their behavior and God will refuse to bless them. I know a church like that in West Virginia which I don't believe will ever experience revival or renewal because their leadership refuses to repent and humble themselves. You started your comments by asking what is meant by church. It has several meanings in the new testament, but the most often reference to church is the local church or local meeting of believers.

 

[MennoSota]

I guess that depends on what you mean by corporate. I do believe that local churches can displease God by their behavior and God will refuse to bless them. I know a church like that in West Virginia which I don't believe will ever experience revival or renewal because their leadership refuses to repent and humble themselves. You started your comments by asking what is meant by church. It has several meanings in the new testament, but the most often reference to church is the local church or local meeting of believers.

Thanks for the clarification. I agree. Jesus letter to the churches in Revelation confirms God's work in each gathering. God does not seem to abide false teachers and charlatans posing as his servants. God also corrects his children with the purpose of reimagining us in unity with his holiness. We should therefore not be surprised when he chastenes us. Rather the lack of chastening points to illegitimacy.

 

[NewCreation435]

Thanks for the clarification. I agree. Jesus letter to the churches in Revelation confirms God's work in each gathering. God does not seem to abide false teachers and charlatans posing as his servants. God also corrects his children with the purpose of reimagining us in unity with his holiness. We should therefore not be surprised when he chastenes us. Rather the lack of chastening points to illegitimacy.

I think this is confirmed in this passage
Hebrews 12:6-11
For those whom the Lord loves He disciplines,
And He scourges every son whom He receives.”
7 It is for discipline that you endure; God deals with you as with sons; for what son is there whom his father does not discipline? 8 But if you are without discipline, of which all have become partakers, then you are illegitimate children and not sons. 9 Furthermore, we had earthly fathers to discipline us, and we respected them; shall we not much rather be subject to the Father of spirits, and live? 10 For they disciplined us for a short time as seemed best to them, but He disciplines us for our good, so that we may share His holiness. 11 All discipline for the moment seems not to be joyful, but sorrowful; yet to those who have been trained by it, afterwards it yields the peaceful fruit of righteousness.

 

[Albion]

yes, it does. most of the time it seems to be very petty, childish judging that isn't warranted, but that's just my opinion

Well, I do not doubt that that is the case, people being what they are an given to gossip an nit-picking.

But I was holding open the possibility that members of the congregation might be critical of someone among them who was behaving in an actually sinful manner.

 

[NewCreation435]

Well, I do not doubt that that is the case, people being what they are an given to gossip an nit-picking.

But I was holding open the possibility that members of the congregation might be critical of someone among them who was behaving in an actually sinful manner.

I only know of one time when a member of a church that I was visiting was discipline. The church stripped the person of their ordaination due to his behavior. Attempts were made by the church to correct the person and they didn't respond or change their behavior, so the church removed their ordaination of that person.

 

[Albion]

I agree. Criticizing or removing someone for real cause is no doubt less common than gossiping against ordinary members of the congregation for something much less important, but I was just saying that it is probably not enough to reply to your earlier comment without making this distinction.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Some congregations grow because people follow a preacher/pastor/priest who has a name for exciting and interesting style. Make what you like of that as growth.

Some congregations do not grow or even shrink while faithfully walking according to the faith that they proclaim and while helping those who need it. Make what you will of that kind of no-change or decline.

There are many reasons for growth, no-change, and decline.

What do you think the measure of a congregation really is?

 

[NewCreation435]

Some congregations grow because people follow a preacher/pastor/priest who has a name for exciting and interesting style. Make what you like of that as growth.

Some congregations do not grow or even shrink while faithfully walking according to the faith that they proclaim and while helping those who need it. Make what you will of that kind of no-change or decline.

There are many reasons for growth, no-change, and decline.

What do you think the measure of a congregation really is?

I don't think there is one litmus test that you could do to measure a congregation. In a church that I attended and worked at in 2001, the community was declining in population by at least 4 or 5% a year. It had been much more than that. It was down to only a couple of hundred from thousands of people who had lived there. The big oil company Exxon/Mobil moved out of town and when they did all the jobs went with them.
So, this church that was once busting at the seams is now down to about 50 faithful people and they are doing the best they can, but they are swimming against the tide. There is spiritual growth there because adversity has strengthened them, but not growth in numbers. There is a fellowship there. I saw them put a new roof on a members house once at no cost to her. Everyone just pitched in and bought supplies and made it happen. You wouldn't typically see that in a larger church

 

[tango]

Everyone just pitched in and bought supplies and made it happen. You wouldn't typically see that in a larger church

I still remember a friend who went to a huge church. He was always running around giving lifts to the minister and his family. Needless to say when he needed a ride the silence was deafening. When he was sick for three weeks it seemed nobody at the church even noticed.

I can't help think that any church so large an individual can be virtually anonymous probably isn't much of a church.