Obsolete

[MoreCoffee]

I wondered if I ought to write this post in the technology section rather than in the theology section but on reflection the topic is more theological than it is technological.

With the progress we're seeing in computer simulated intelligence and the possibility of genuine artificial intelligence being generated human beings may be obsolete in our own world. Work of every kind may become the province of machines built fit for purpose and with whatever level of intelligence (simulated or real) is required. And people will no longer be needed for work. What will we do? What will our role be and how will human dignity as God's image bearers be maintained in a world without meaningful work?

I am retired so I have some idea about what it is like to be out of the working population but in my case retirement was completely voluntary and I enjoy it because I wanted to be free from the need to work and my finances allowed me to do that. But I am well aware that many people are either not in a financial state that allows retirement or they are not in a mental state that makes retirement desirable.

The holy scriptures are the product of a world where robots and intelligent machines were not possible so we find little guidance in them for the issues arising from automation. And the holy scriptures assume that people work for their living. Will that be so for coming generations? There is discussion about introducing a universal basic income (UBI) because people will not be working for many periods in their life and they will still need an income in order to live. How will we manage that if we try to retain biblical patters of work and wages based life? Will free market capitalism survive a world with a UBI or will socialism of some kind become dominant and can Christianity survive a world with state paid incomes as the norm and state control of income and income distribution?


There's issues around what will the unemployed do? Will anybody be employed? Will human beings be obsolete? Will God's created order be replaced by a machine order made by human kind but no longer controlled by human beings?

 

[MennoSota]

I wondered if I ought to write this post in the technology section rather than in the theology section but on reflection the topic is more theological than it is technological.

With the progress we're seeing in computer simulated intelligence and the possibility of genuine artificial intelligence being generated human beings may be obsolete in our own world. Work of every kind may become the province of machines built fit for purpose and with whatever level of intelligence (simulated or real) is required. And people will no longer be needed for work. What will we do? What will our role be and how will human dignity as God's image bearers be maintained in a world without meaningful work?

I am retired so I have some idea about what it is like to be out of the working population but in my case retirement was completely voluntary and I enjoy it because I wanted to be free from the need to work and my finances allowed me to do that. But I am well aware that many people are either not in a financial state that allows retirement or they are not in a mental state that makes retirement desirable.

The holy scriptures are the product of a world where robots and intelligent machines were not possible so we find little guidance in them for the issues arising from automation. And the holy scriptures assume that people work for their living. Will that be so for coming generations? There is discussion about introducing a universal basic income (UBI) because people will not be working for many periods in their life and they will still need an income in order to live. How will we manage that if we try to retain biblical patters of work and wages based life? Will free market capitalism survive a world with a UBI or will socialism of some kind become dominant and can Christianity survive a world with state paid incomes as the norm and state control of income and income distribution?


There's issues around what will the unemployed do? Will anybody be employed? Will human beings be obsolete? Will God's created order be replaced by a machine order made by human kind but no longer controlled by human beings?

You are assuming an upward trajectory with no human suffering. How much does AI help the people of Syria?

 

[Josiah]

On a MUCH more general note, I tend to think that our species is SO successful, SO fast..... maybe our own greatness will be our own undoing. Whether that's war, destroying our environment, creating our own replacement as a species or ????? I don't know. It's possible to be TOO successful? One's greatest attribute can be their worse? We can be our OWN destroyer?

 

[Confessional Lutheran]

I wondered if I ought to write this post in the technology section rather than in the theology section but on reflection the topic is more theological than it is technological.

With the progress we're seeing in computer simulated intelligence and the possibility of genuine artificial intelligence being generated human beings may be obsolete in our own world. Work of every kind may become the province of machines built fit for purpose and with whatever level of intelligence (simulated or real) is required. And people will no longer be needed for work. What will we do? What will our role be and how will human dignity as God's image bearers be maintained in a world without meaningful work?

I am retired so I have some idea about what it is like to be out of the working population but in my case retirement was completely voluntary and I enjoy it because I wanted to be free from the need to work and my finances allowed me to do that. But I am well aware that many people are either not in a financial state that allows retirement or they are not in a mental state that makes retirement desirable.

The holy scriptures are the product of a world where robots and intelligent machines were not possible so we find little guidance in them for the issues arising from automation. And the holy scriptures assume that people work for their living. Will that be so for coming generations? There is discussion about introducing a universal basic income (UBI) because people will not be working for many periods in their life and they will still need an income in order to live. How will we manage that if we try to retain biblical patters of work and wages based life? Will free market capitalism survive a world with a UBI or will socialism of some kind become dominant and can Christianity survive a world with state paid incomes as the norm and state control of income and income distribution?


There's issues around what will the unemployed do? Will anybody be employed? Will human beings be obsolete? Will God's created order be replaced by a machine order made by human kind but no longer controlled by human beings?

That might depend on what your definition of " meaningful work" is. People are still spiritual as well as physical beings and that spiritual side will always need to be accomodated. Therefore, I'm pretty sure Christianity will survive all this mechanization. We might, however, have to find our own purpose that doesn't always involve a rat race of hard toil, meagre pay and little rest. Perhaps with all this advancement, humanity's current economy will become obsolete and we might not need to worry about things such as sufficient food, reliable shelter and access to good medical care.

Perhaps before all this happens, Jesus Christ will return and establish His Kingdom here on Earth and everything will be made new. All of humanity's efforts to recreate the world in its own image will come to nothing and once more we will see God's Will veto our own. Perhaps His Parousia will occur after all this happens, when people say " all is well and secure." When Noah and his kids were busy with building the Ark, their neighbors apparently just thought they were building a curiosity and they went on with their lives until the Flood came and wiped them out.

I think that what I'm saying is that God is in control and even when we humans have no idea where we are headed, the same God who created the Heavens and the earth is also Lord of history and we are moving in a trajectory He foreknew before our ancestors even dreamed about making conveniences we take for granted today. It's best left in the Lord's Hands, I think.

 

[NewCreation435]

AI sounds interesting but machines eventually break down, parts have to be made for them, they have to be manufactured and they can't do everything. I don't see AI working in the counseling profession at all. Nor do I see it being implemented in third world countries or where income is very limited.

 

[meluckycharms]

AI sounds interesting but machines eventually break down, parts have to be made for them, they have to be manufactured and they can't do everything. I don't see AI working in the counseling profession at all. Nor do I see it being implemented in third world countries or where income is very limited.

Unless you get machines that fix the machines. It could be like WALL.E

 

[tango]

That might depend on what your definition of " meaningful work" is. People are still spiritual as well as physical beings and that spiritual side will always need to be accomodated. Therefore, I'm pretty sure Christianity will survive all this mechanization. We might, however, have to find our own purpose that doesn't always involve a rat race of hard toil, meagre pay and little rest. Perhaps with all this advancement, humanity's current economy will become obsolete and we might not need to worry about things such as sufficient food, reliable shelter and access to good medical care.

What counts as "meaningful work" is certainly a valid question. The current status quo tends to see people either doing work they dislike because it pays well, or doing work based on the need to earn something regardless of what they might be good or what they might like to do.

One major issue with technology is that it is generally very bad at producing the promised gains. In years gone by there was talk of letting machines do all the work while we humans sat and relaxed, freed from the requirement to perform physically demanding work. We can see how well that turned out. Even at a more basic level we can look at the number of doodads that promise to save us time in the house, save us time in the kitchen and so on - maybe they do save us a little time but then they need to be cleaned, they need to be stored, they break down, and so on.

As for cellphones, the promise of being able to be in contact with others, wherever we are and wherever they are, rapidly turned from a huge blessing to a nuisance - from the people expected to be on call at any time by employers, to the person shouting inanely into their phone on a crowded train, to the number of people apparently unable to construct a coherent sentence because of endlessly writing in "text message speak", to the growing inability of people to make a coherent argument thanks to the echo chambers so readily facilitated by social media - what promised to liberate us turned around and enslaved us.

Perhaps before all this happens, Jesus Christ will return and establish His Kingdom here on Earth and everything will be made new. All of humanity's efforts to recreate the world in its own image will come to nothing and once more we will see God's Will veto our own. Perhaps His Parousia will occur after all this happens, when people say " all is well and secure." When Noah and his kids were busy with building the Ark, their neighbors apparently just thought they were building a curiosity and they went on with their lives until the Flood came and wiped them out.

I certainly hope there aren't cellphones in heaven