What message do you take away from Job?

[MennoSota]

Whenever one tries to read a mythology as literal truth it is almost inevitable that huge contradictions will be found.

LOL, perhaps when I read your post, I was reading a mythology.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The story of Job is a morality tale. It is a little bit like the story of Jonah and the story of Tobit. But I was wondering what you each take away from reading God's long speech near the end of the story of Job?

 

[Josiah]

The story of Job is a morality tale. It is a little bit like the story of Jonah and the story of Tobit. But I was wondering what you each take away from reading God's long speech near the end of the story of Job?

From this account (and I don't know if it's literally historical or a kind of morality play), I gather several points.... among them...

1 ______ happens. It's a part of our fallen, broken, sinful world.
2. God may PERMIT _______ but God is not the CAUSE.
3. It's okay to ask questions, just don't appoint self (or "friends") to answer them.
4. Trust God. ESPECIALLY when ______ happens.
5. Yeah, "all things work for good to those that love God" but not necessarily this side of heaven....
6. It's easier when all goes well.... It's HARD when all seems to fall apart.... remember that when others are going through ______
7. It's more helpful to ask "What should I do?" than "How come?"

 

[MoreCoffee]

From this account (and I don't know if it's literally historical or a kind of morality play), I gather several points.... among them...

1 ______ happens. It's a part of our fallen, broken, sinful world.
2. God may PERMIT _______ but God is not the CAUSE.
3. It's okay to ask questions, just don't appoint self (or "friends") to answer them.
4. Trust God. ESPECIALLY when ______ happens.
5. Yeah, "all things work for good to those that love God" but not necessarily this side of heaven....
6. It's easier when all goes well.... It's HARD when all seems to fall apart.... remember that when others are going through ______
7. It's more helpful to ask "What should I do/thin/feel?" than "How come?"

______ means "bad things"?

:smirk:

 

[pinacled]

What I learned from Yov (job)
Firstly: that satan is a liar, and all the calamity including the death of his Children were a lie.
Secondly: that wicked counsel gives no comfort to any person.
And lastly and most importantly is the strength in forgiveness.

As for the pillars of the firmament to each person who upholds faith in Yeshua (jesus) the one with the Seven stars in his Hand.
There are tender dreams upon those who praise the Holy One.
Praise Him, sun and moon; praise Him, all stars of the night.
Personally I love this psalm as if the words were to the dearest of friends.

sun and moon, sheresh and yareach.

A sun of righteousness in the peacefull evening wisdom of faith, kept as a treasure in the house of the Lord.
For out of abundance a silver light memory cascades upon the season's furnace.

 

[pinacled]

I wonder if anyone here would incline a thought for a moment.
Even dare to boldly approach the throne with a gift.

I've heard that there are those walking in prayer that have exceeded the righteousness of Yov (job).
How could a person do so?

I ask as a single, a second, and even a third witness to comfort such a person as myself in the matter. Should such an occasion arise that increase were to be freely given.
I ask all readers to seek the Heart of our Lord with earnest sincerity and answer as the Holy Spirit speaks.

 

[MennoSota]

The story of Job is a morality tale. It is a little bit like the story of Jonah and the story of Tobit. But I was wondering what you each take away from reading God's long speech near the end of the story of Job?

The story of Job is not a morality tale. Let's throw that notion away.
The story of Job is a tale of humans trying to create God in their own image based upon the experiences they have. It is a story of God declaring His unassailable Sovereignty. God does what He wills for reasons only God knows. God's answer is the same as Paul's in Romans 9:29
"Who are you, a mere human being, to argue with God? Should the thing that was created say to the one who created it, “Why have you made me like this?”"

 

[pinacled]

Yet you have missed again.
Where in what yov (job) said through out the counsel did his countenance fail.
?

 

[pinacled]

Tobit*
Oil only ceased when a man allows another to convince a person to curse.

 

[pinacled]

The answer is bless those that curse you.
In the cloud, there are men who have acceded three men in patience.

 

[pinacled]

Job, cursed the day he was born.
Noah cursed his son.
And Daniel sought what exactly?

 

[MoreCoffee]

Job, cursed the day he was born.
Noah cursed his son.
And Daniel sought what exactly?

The thread is about Job 38:1-41:34 - the long speech by God.

 

[pinacled]

The thread is about Job 38:1-41:34 - the long speech by God.

"Who is this who gives dark counsel, with words, without knowledge?

im pretty sure my Lord was speaking of the wicked counselor
satan is a liar.

 

[pinacled]

"Who is this who gives dark counsel, with words, without knowledge?

im pretty sure my Lord was speaking of the wicked counselor
satan is a liar.

For instance in Hoshea 4
My people were silenced [destroyed] for lack of knowledge; because you have rejected knowledge, I will also reject you from being a priest to me; seeing that you have forgotten the Torah of your God, I, too, will forget your children.

the link gives some helpful parallels
http://biblehub.com/hosea/4-6.htm

 

[MoreCoffee]

"Who is this who gives dark counsel, with words, without knowledge?

im pretty sure my Lord was speaking of the wicked counselor
satan is a liar.

In the quote from the first post the first words are "Who are you to question my wisdom with your ignorant, empty words? Now stand up straight and answer the questions I ask you. "

 

[Confessional Lutheran]

What do I take from this? That God's ways are above our own, for one. For another, if there are things even in God's own Creation that we can't understand ( and there are), how can we hope to comprehend the reasonings of the Almighty? Our capacities are finite, God's capacities on the other hand, are not. Job would presume to judge God on principles based on human reason, but God Himself is over and above such things. All things are subordinate to God, from the weakest to the strongest, for God Himself is that Power that overcomes all things in Heaven and Earth. All judgments and determinations belong to God. He is not subject to human frailties, nor does He answer to His own creatures.

 

[MoreCoffee]

What do I take from this? That God's ways are above our own, for one. For another, if there are things even in God's own Creation that we can't understand ( and there are), how can we hope to comprehend the reasonings of the Almighty? Our capacities are finite, God's capacities on the other hand, are not. Job would presume to judge God on principles based on human reason, but God Himself is over and above such things. All things are subordinate to God, from the weakest to the strongest, for God Himself is that Power that overcomes all things in Heaven and Earth. All judgments and determinations belong to God. He is not subject to human frailties, nor does He answer to His own creatures.

I don't know how to take the speech. It doesn't give any answer to Job that some pious person would not have given and that leaves me wondering if the speech is only a human being's view of how God might answer Job rather than something God revealed as the answer to Job's dilemma - namely why does a just man suffer while wicked men prosper? It's the same old "problem of evil" that nobody really has a satisfying answer for except to throw it down as a mystery that trust in God alleviates even if it does not inform and answer.

 

[Confessional Lutheran]

I don't know how to take the speech. It doesn't give any answer to Job that some pious person would not have given and that leaves me wondering if the speech is only a human being's view of how God might answer Job rather than something God revealed as the answer to Job's dilemma - namely why does a just man suffer while wicked men prosper? It's the same old "problem of evil" that nobody really has a satisfying answer for except to throw it down as a mystery that trust in God alleviates even if it does not inform and answer.

Well, MC, all I can really say to that is that my belief states that if it's in the Scriptures, then God said it. If God said it ( and it's impossible for God to lie), then I believe it. For me, that settles it. That will probably come across as a cliché, but I really don't know any better way to put it. The Bible is God's Word put to ink and paper. So, God did, in fact, say those things to Job out of the whirlwind. That's my take.

 

[MoreCoffee]

Well, MC, all I can really say to that is that my belief states that if it's in the Scriptures, then God said it. If God said it ( and it's impossible for God to lie), then I believe it. For me, that settles it. That will probably come across as a cliché, but I really don't know any better way to put it. The Bible is God's Word put to ink and paper. So, God did, in fact, say those things to Job out of the whirlwind. That's my take.

Paul could not remember who he baptised after he thanked God he had not baptised any except for some names ... he was happy to admit (under inspiration) that his memory was error prone so I take that as something Paul said about himself rather than something God revealed. In a similar way what is said at the end of Job in God's speech looks like the pious admission of mystery that the author of the book makes rather than as a revelation from God. It looks like what pious people say and did say in ancient times. Today people come to the same conclusion but sometimes they have a lot of fancy ideas to dress it up. Yet it comes down to "I haven't got a clue why the good suffer and wicked people do just fine, it's a mystery that only God knows the answer to"

 

[pinacled]

Paul could not remember who he baptised after he thanked God he had not baptised any except for some names ... he was happy to admit (under inspiration) that his memory was error prone so I take that as something Paul said about himself rather than something God revealed. In a similar way what is said at the end of Job in God's speech looks like the pious admission of mystery that the author of the book makes rather than as a revelation from God. It looks like what pious people say and did say in ancient times. Today people come to the same conclusion but sometimes they have a lot of fancy ideas to dress it up. Yet it comes down to "I haven't got a clue why the good suffer and wicked people do just fine, it's a mystery that only God knows the answer to"

But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive yours. 16When you fast, do not be somber like the hypocrites, for they disfigure their faces to show men they are fasting. Truly I tell you, they already have their reward. 17But when you fast, anoint your head and wash your face,…

Hebrews 11:1King James Version (KJV)
11 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

What suffering are you talking about. And the version you posted is about the strangest variation ive seen.
Yov(job) was lied to by satan.
His family was just fine.
though his lamenting and behavior may of reminded me of something in the Torah.
Something concerning baal worship.
28So they cried with a loud voice and cut themselves according to their custom with swords and lances until the blood gushed out on them. 29When midday was past, they raved until the time of the offering of the evening sacrifice; but there was no voice, no one answered, and no one paid attention.…