John 16:13-16
[13]When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own but will tell you what he has heard. He will tell you about the future.
[14]He will bring me glory by telling you whatever he receives from me.
[15]All that belongs to the Father is mine; this is why I said, ‘The Spirit will tell you whatever he receives from me.’
[16]“In a little while you won’t see me anymore. But a little while after that, you will see me again.”
Should this conversation from Jesus to his disciples be applied to us today?
The context is specifically to those disciples regarding the events they would experience. I think it is unwise to apply this conversation to us today.
Ahhh, ok thx, that clears it up.
Initially, w out a post quoted, I thought you were directing your other post to me since it followed mine. Now I see the passage you were referring to (which I'm not sure who initially posted it) but yes, thats diff than the 1stJohn verse I posted, which, as I had said, I find great comfort and reassurance from, for all saved believers. The John 16 passage is partly applicable, imo.
Only verse 16 is only for the disciples.
That is a really good answer! Verse 16 does show that it could only apply to ppl who were PHYSICALLY seeing him, and in the context of only the 4 verses mentioned, that makes sense....but now MennoSota presents a bigger challenge in the following quote →
I don't agree. The context shows that the "you" in these verses is specifically addressing the disciples/apostles. The Spirit did exactly those things for the disciples, but not today. There is no need for new, inspired, revelation to which the Spirit would speak. Only groups like the Mormons, Muslims and other cults suggest there is still progressive revelation. That is how they elevate their leaders to apostolic status, even though they contradict God's word.
If the 'you' in the above 4 verses applies ONLY to the disciples that Jesus was physically speaking with at the time, then how far in both directions should we read the passage to try to determine what else applies only to them, and not to subsequent believers down through time?
You could reasonably back up and say that all of Chapter 15 only applies to those that were with Him at the time as well. What about even C.14? He's saying much the same thing in v.19,
And in v.25 He even says so Himself.
Ch15:16, another example, and in 15:27 He says so again.
And in our context passage, if we continue reading, we have v.22→, v.25, ... is the whole rest of the chapter only applying to those present with Him then?
A case could be made for that in light of the position taken re: 16:13-16.
I don't know if I'm willing to draw that hard line,
but then, by not doing so, it CAN make things a bit murky.
If ALL of Chapters 14, 15, and 16 DONT apply ONLY to those that were present, then which parts do we allow, to include other believers, all the way up to and including ourselves?
Very interesting MennoSota, and THANKS! (sarcastically, lol), I was hoping for a quiet Friday night where I didnt have to think :no: !!)
Or can we just say, in one sense 'It ALL applies to us, since those disciples handed it down, and God recorded it for us, in His Word for us, even today?'
(Yeah, that probably wont fly, will it? :disgonbegood
