The Book of Revelation: Four "takes"

[Josiah]

The Book of Revelation is certainly unusual.... It is said there are 4 basic "schools" on how to see it

PRETERNIST: All the events of the Book were fulfilled during the period of the Roman Empire; they are all history now.

HISTORICAL: The Book is a panorama of church history from the Apostolic era through the consummation.

IDEALIST: The Book is not a representation of actual events but is a symbolic or parabolic depiction of the spiritual warfare of the age.

FUTURIST: Beginning with chapter 4, the Book is a depiction of future events accompanying the End of the age.



Do you agree with that summery of views? Where do you most agree?


I'll admit this Book is very difficult for me. I suspect I'm a bit in the Historical and also Idealist camps.



Pax Christi



- Josiah

 

[Lamb]

I was unaware there were four views in regards to Revelation. I think I'm with you in regards to historical and idealist.

 

[NewCreation435]

I use to be very dogmatic about this, but now I'm not sure at all. I do think the beginning of the book when the Lord is speaking to specific churches has to do with what was going on then. Though we can learn a lot from their strengths and problems. Clearly some of it has to do with future events and there is a lot of symbolism in it.

 

[MoreCoffee]

The Apocalypse is chiefly liturgical.

 

[psalms 91]

A little of three of them, I do not believe that the events have already happened

 

[NewCreation435]

The Apocalypse is chiefly liturgical.

please explain this more

 

[JRT]

I would go with the "idealist" point of view. While Revelation may be of interest to the scholar, I do not think it holds much, if any, relevance to Christians today. It would seem that John of Patmos was a very bitter man who might actually have been psychotic.

 

[MoreCoffee]

please explain this more

MAny of the settings and many of the activities described in the book are taken from the liturgy. The book is not so difficult to follow when it is read in that light.

 

[NewCreation435]

MAny of the settings and many of the activities described in the book are taken from the liturgy. The book is not so difficult to follow when it is read in that light.

so for those of use who don't follow the same liturgy you do could you give me an example. I am trying to understand what you mean.

 

[MoreCoffee]

so for those of use who don't follow the same liturgy you do could you give me an example. I am trying to understand what you mean.

The liturgy has a progression that runs something like this.

• Introductory rites, including
  • greetings,
  • corporate prayer of confession of sins and
  • pronouncement of forgiveness,
  • prayer of praise and thanksgiving
• Readings from holy scripture old testament first, then a psalm, then a new testament reading (usually from the new testament letters) and then a reading from the holy gospels
• a sermon (we call it a homily) which is short (usually between 10 and 15 minutes)
• Prayers for people and for the welfare of the church
• The remainder of the liturgy (about one half of it) is concerned with the gospel message, Christ's self offering, and the Eucharist which is received in this portion of the liturgy. These are about the church and her growth to maturity.

Up to this point the general flow is similar to the first eleven chapters of the Apocalypse of John. Several of these chapters appear to be recapitulation of Israel's history though the recapitulation is not exhaustive.

• The vision of the ark in the temple and the woman clothed in the sun and with the moon under her feet and twelve stars in her hair or as a crown or halo-like arrangement
• The persecution of her children by the great dragon & their rescue by the earth
• The beasts from land and sea
• and so forth ...

Then the chapters appear to follow the history of the church under persecuting Rome (the pagan empire under the emperors)

• The 144,000 and the lamb in heaven
• The three angel's messages
• the great harvest

the above appears to point to the peace given to the church, her growth, and the abundant harvest of the children
The next few chapters appear to point to the coming judgement against Rome and probably also use Rome's downfall as a template for the end of the ages and the coming last judgement
There are some intervals where heaven is depicted and these also appear to follow liturgical patterns.

I hope that helps.