God and his love

[TurtleHare]

Is God's love really unconditional?

 

[Josiah]

Is God's love really unconditional?

Well, it's in view of Christ - but yes, as it embraces us, it is unconditional in that it flows to us because God is love, not because we are so lovable.

 

[TurtleHare]

Well, it's in view of Christ - but yes, as it embraces us, it is unconditional in that it flows to us because God is love, not because we are so lovable.

Does God have conditions that require us to love him?

 

[Josiah]

Does God have conditions that require us to love him?

His Law requires such, but His love does not require that.

The Law (even in the OT) says that we are to love the Lord our God with all our heart and soul and mind. Of course, the Law is never fulfilled by any mere mortal so NO ONE actually does that. God loves us NOT because no one loves Him as His Law mandates but because God IS love.

And for Christians, this belongs to sanctification (the RESPONSE to His love, mercy, grace, blessings, gifts) "Love one another just as I first loved you."

 

[Lamb]

For our salvation God has placed no conditions upon us that Jesus has not already met

 

[MennoSota]

God can only love that which is holy (set apart). This is why God hates sin and He hates sinners. Every lawbreaker is hated by God. But, God is patient with law breakers so that He might choose to make some holy by substituting Christ's holy life for our sinful life. Jesus atonement for my sin makes me holy when I stand before God the Father. It is Jesus and Jesus alone that justifies me before God. My own life brings God's utter wrath.

 

[Josiah]

God doesn't MAKE us holy, He loves us and has mercy on us - and because of Jesus - forgives us.

 

[TurtleHare]

God doesn't MAKE us holy, He loves us and has mercy on us - and because of Jesus - forgives us.

What do you mean when you say God doesn't MAKE us holy?

 

[Josiah]

What do you mean when you say God doesn't MAKE us holy?

I reject infused grace.... I agree with St. Paul that we always remain both saint and sinner, sinner because we are not holy and saint because we live in His mercy and viewed through the blood of the Lamb.

 

[Lamb]

The apostles creed
The third article:
On being made holy


I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy catholic church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body,
and the life everlasting
Amen
WHAT IS THIS?
or
WHAT DOES THIS MEAN?
I believe that by my own understanding or strength I cannot believe in Jesus
Christ my Lord or come to him, but instead the Holy Spirit has called me
through the gospel, enlightened me with his gifts, made me holy and kept me
in the true faith, just as he calls, gathers, enlightens, and makes holy the whole
Christian church on earth and keeps it with Jesus Christ in the one common,
true faith
Daily in this Christian church the Holy Spirit abundantly forgives
all sins—mine and those of all believers
On the last day the Holy Spirit will
raise me and all the dead and will give to me and all believers in Christ eternal
life
This is most certainly true

 

[Ruth]

God can only love that which is holy (set apart). This is why God hates sin and He hates sinners. Every lawbreaker is hated by God. But, God is patient with law breakers so that He might choose to make some holy by substituting Christ's holy life for our sinful life. Jesus atonement for my sin makes me holy when I stand before God the Father. It is Jesus and Jesus alone that justifies me before God. My own life brings God's utter wrath.

Is it possible that God does not hate sinners but hates sins? If he loves us how can he hate us or is that something I don't comprehend as of yet?

 

[MennoSota]

Does a judge love law breakers? A loving judge will bring the sentence required by the law.

Is it possible that God does not hate sinners but hates sins? If he loves us how can he hate us or is that something I don't comprehend as of yet?

 

[Ruth]

Does a judge love law breakers? A loving judge will bring the sentence required by the law.

The law of God is different than the law of God. I don't see my God as hating at all. Perhaps the judge may love law breakers but not what they did. That was all I was saying.

 

[MennoSota]

The law of God is different than the law of God. I don't see my God as hating at all. Perhaps the judge may love law breakers but not what they did. That was all I was saying.

This passage informs my thoughts.
Romans 9:7-23
[7]Being descendants of Abraham doesn’t make them truly Abraham’s children. For the Scriptures say, “Isaac is the son through whom your descendants will be counted,” though Abraham had other children, too.
[8]This means that Abraham’s physical descendants are not necessarily children of God. Only the children of the promise are considered to be Abraham’s children.
[9]For God had promised, “I will return about this time next year, and Sarah will have a son.”
[10]This son was our ancestor Isaac. When he married Rebekah, she gave birth to twins.
[11]But before they were born, before they had done anything good or bad, she received a message from God. (This message shows that God chooses people according to his own purposes;
[12]he calls people, but not according to their good or bad works.) She was told, “Your older son will serve your younger son.”
[13]In the words of the Scriptures, “I loved Jacob, but I rejected Esau.”
[14]Are we saying, then, that God was unfair? Of course not!
[15]For God said to Moses, “I will show mercy to anyone I choose, *** and I will show compassion to anyone I choose.”
[16]So it is God who decides to show mercy. We can neither choose it nor work for it.
[17]For the Scriptures say that God told Pharaoh, “I have appointed you for the very purpose of displaying my power in you and to spread my fame throughout the earth.”
[18]So you see, God chooses to show mercy to some, and he chooses to harden the hearts of others so they refuse to listen.
[19]Well then, you might say, “Why does God blame people for not responding? Haven’t they simply done what he makes them do?”
[20]No, don’t say that. Who are you, a mere human being, to argue with God? Should the thing that was created say to the one who created it, “Why have you made me like this?”
[21]When a potter makes jars out of clay, doesn’t he have a right to use the same lump of clay to make one jar for decoration and another to throw garbage into?
[22]In the same way, even though God has the right to show his anger and his power, he is very patient with those on whom his anger falls, who are destined for destruction.
[23]He does this to make the riches of his glory shine even brighter on those to whom he shows mercy, who were prepared in advance for glory.

 

[Josiah]

The law of God is different than the law of God. I don't see my God as hating at all. Perhaps the judge may love law breakers but not what they did. That was all I was saying.

I think we have a terminology issue here..... "HATE" = to disapprove. Can one disapprove of a behavior and yet UNCONDITIONALLY love the person? I think so.....



.

 

[Ruth]

I think we have a terminology issue here..... "HATE" = to disapprove. Can one disapprove of a behavior and yet UNCONDITIONALLY love the person? I think so.....



.

Wasn't I saying that anyhow?

 

[TangledWeb]

Does God have conditions that require us to love him?

No. For God so loved the world was not conditional upon us and we do not gain his love but we are his love since he created us and he loved us so much that he felt a need to die for us even when we were not worthy.