Faith Is Not the Opposite of Reason

[VeritatisVerba]

Faith Is Not the Opposite of Reason, It Is the Fruit of It!​

I’ve read heartfelt stories, tales of surviving the streets, enduring the horrors of war, dealing with economic hardship, chronic illness, and even the death of a child. In each one, faith is described as the only thing that carried them through the darkest corners of life. These experiences carry weight and a raw honesty that commands respect. They shape us, stir the soul, and spark something that, at the very least, feels like faith. Yet when we peel back the layers, a question lingers: is faith merely what we feel in the fire, or is it something more, something grounded beyond our physical and emotional scars?

Faith, at least the biblical kind of faith, might be born in suffering, but it is forged in truth. It is not merely a reflex in response to hardship or a balm for pain or some other sort of coping mechanism. It is a deliberate trust in what is real, even when emotions pull us elsewhere. We all know, deep down, that emotions make a shaky foundation. They shift with the wind, up one day and down the next, swayed by mood, memory, circumstance, and even the weather. No one builds a house on such shifty sand and expects it to stand.

Reason, on the other hand, offers solid ground. When it is rooted in evidence and sound logic, something objective, it becomes something that does not bend with our feelings or falter under life’s weight. Faith, rightly understood, is not about turning off one’s mind, ignoring evidence or clinging to contradictions. It is about looking carefully at what God has revealed, His creation, His promises, His character, His acts, concluding that they are trustworthy and then acting accordingly, whether our emotions are in sync or not.

Abraham did not prepare to sacrifice Isaac because he felt some sort of mystical prompting that he couldn’t understand or even articulate. One the contrary, he reasoned that God could raise the dead (Hebrews 11:19). His faith was not a leap into the dark, it was a step onto a foundation he had tested and found firm. That is not anti-reason, it is the fruit of reason, a trust born from rational confidence.

Biblical faith often runs against emotion. Jesus in Gethsemane did not feel like going to the cross but He resolved to do His Father’s will. Paul in prison did not feel triumphant but chose to rejoice in the Lord. The Psalms are filled with cries of abandonment and fear, yet they often conclude with a conscious decision to trust. This is not blind faith! This is faith with eyes wide open, anchored in truth, often in defiance of the emotional storm.

We see this same principle at work in everyday life. You would not hand your children over to a total stranger, but you might entrust them to a police officer whom you never met before. Why? Because the uniform, the badge, the marked car, the calm authority in his voice, etc. are all indicators, pieces of evidence, that tell you that he belongs to a category of people other than “a complete stranger” and that you have reason to trust. Your confidence is not blind; it rests on identifiable cues that justify it. Faith in God is no different. It is not a leap into the dark, but a step toward what the mind has recognized as true. It calls us to rise above emotional turmoil and anchor ourselves in reality, not simply in what brings temporary relief.

This does not mean emotions or personal experiences are irrelevant. On the contrary, they often awaken in us the hunger for something deeper. They stir questions that reason must then answer. Surviving a crisis may spark a longing to know whether God is real. Walking with someone through despair may awaken a sense of purpose. These moments are powerful. Yet if we lean on them alone, our foundation will crack. Faith that is only “what got me through” is only as strong as the last crisis. Pain is not proof. Survival is not theology.

Consider someone who believes in fate because a string of coincidences saved them from disaster, or someone who believes that the child they lost to cancer became a guardian angel because the thought eases the grief. These beliefs may comfort, but comfort does not make them true. Faith that rests on emotional response alone will collapse when the feelings fade or the narrative shifts, because it is not grounded in God or His word or anything objective. It is grounded in you! Worse than that, it’s based on the squishiest, least reliable part of you.

To be clear, this is not a call to suppress emotion or to treat it as unworthy. On the contrary! Emotion has its place, but it must be grounded in truth, not in spite of it. When faith is grounded in what is real, it does not stifle feeling, it liberates it. A heart anchored in reason and evidence can feel much more deeply, not less. When you know that God is real and that His Word stands, your joy is not shallow, your peace is not fragile, and your grief does not undo you. You can weep without despair, trust without worry, hope without pretending and love without fear. Confidence in what is true does not silence the soul, it gives it wings!

C. S. Lewis captures this beautifully in Mere Christianity:

“Now Faith, in the sense in which I am here using the word, is the art of holding on to things your reason has once accepted, in spite of your changing moods. For moods will change, whatever view your reason takes. I know that by experience. Now that I am a Christian, I do have moods in which the whole thing looks very improbable: but when I was an atheist I had moods in which Christianity looked terribly probable. This rebellion of your moods against your real self is going to come anyway. That is why Faith is such a necessary virtue: unless you teach your moods ‘where they get off,’ you can never be either a sound Christian or even a sound atheist, but just a creature dithering to and fro, with its beliefs really dependent on the weather and the state of its digestion. Consequently, one must train the habit of Faith.”​

Lewis is right! Faith is not pretending your doubts do not exist, it is holding fast to what your reason has affirmed, even when your emotions rebel. That is not weakness, that is strength. That is not blind belief, it is wisdom!

So, what about your faith? Is it a reaction to pain or a response to truth? Is it built on what you have endured or on what you have examined and found trustworthy? Experiences may spark the journey, but they are not the destination. Faith stands only when it is built on the Rock, not on the shifting sands of struggle or emotional instinct.

(May, 2025)

 

[torial]

I generally like what you are saying here (and many other posts FWIW), a few of thoughts:

1. I have seen people do "logical proofs" that they are absolutely convinced of, but they are not persuasive to others because the one making the proof is not aware of the presuppositions he/she brings to the table. (Not scare quotes, but how they referred to it)
2. I have rationalized certain behaviors and emotions and thoughts, and seen others do this as well. The old man in us still wars against the Spirit, and it knows the buttons to push to get us to react [if you'll forgive the personification]. So while I value reason**, I do not see it as sufficient on this side of Heaven.
3. Re: "So, what about your faith? Is it a reaction to pain or a response to truth?" - This seems like a false dichotomy. Having seen other posts you make, I don't think this is your intent -- probably a wordsmithing issue.

I read a book a few years back called "Faith founded upon Fact" and it made very similar arguments to your post IIRC. I find the argument that we have a God who interacted in real history and therefore there is evidence of that to be an important truth. We aren't dealing with mythology (in the colloquial sense, not the academic sense), but with a Person who interacts with our universe in real time and real history.

Have you seen the argument Scot McKnight makes that the `pistis` is better treated as "believing loyalty". I think such an interpretation is compatible with the kind of faith you are talking about (as opposed to blind faith) -- but would love to hear your thoughts on that.

** I am in the software industry, and issues with reasoning capabilities are the cause of a whole slew of issues there.

 

[VeritatisVerba]

I generally like what you are saying here (and many other posts FWIW), a few of thoughts:

• I have seen people do "logical proofs" that they are absolutely convinced of, but they are not persuasive to others because the one making the proof is not aware of the presuppositions he/she brings to the table. (Not scare quotes, but how they referred to it)

This is an excellent point! This post of yours, by the way, is without a doubt, the most substantive thing I've received in response to anything I've said in a very long time! Very good!

There is no doubt that errors of logic can be made. It isn't even difficult to proceed on the basis of a premise you aren't even aware that you're accepting. Indeed, the difficult thing is to do the mental work required to at least help ensure that no such errors are being made.

BUT....

Even if you make a mistake, it’s better to have reached it through your own reasoning than to have blindly accepted ten truths from someone else. The reason is simple: when you think for yourself, you retain the ability to correct the error. When you surrender that responsibility, turn off your mind and take things on faith (i.e. "blind faith" - not the biblical kind of faith), you lose the only tool that could have exposed the error.

Making an honest mistake is not a moral failure. It’s not a sin to be wrong, provided that it's an honest mistake and that you do NOT turn off your mind and that you’re willing to examine the facts and adjust accordingly. This is what repentance is. What IS a moral failure is the act of intellectual suicide; the act of choosing not to think; choosing not to know. Not a failure to see but choosing to close your eyes. Only someone who expects omniscience would treat every mistake as a moral crime. Reason doesn’t demand perfection, it demands honesty.

• I have rationalized certain behaviors and emotions and thoughts, and seen others do this as well. The old man in us still wars against the Spirit, and it knows the buttons to push to get us to react [if you'll forgive the personification]. So while I value reason**, I do not see it as sufficient on this side of Heaven.

Well, my response above applies to this point as well, except that I'd be careful not to conflate sound reason with rationalizing.

I suspect you already know this but for those who might be reading this....

The difference between sound reason and rationalizing lies in the direction of the thinking process and the relationship it has to truth.

Sound reason starts with a commitment to discover what is true, whether or not the conclusion is comfortable or desirable. It begins with evidence, weighs it honestly, and follows valid rules of logic to wherever it leads. It is objective, disciplined, and open to correction.

Rationalizing, on the other hand, starts with a conclusion already in mind. It works backward, cherry-picking or distorting evidence to justify what one wants to believe. It may use a form of logic, but it is not actually reasoning. In fact, it is a form of self-deception. It is biased, self-serving, and closed off to contradiction. (see ANY post written by brightfame52 for examples.)

In short, sound reason seeks the truth; rationalizing seeks a way to excuse or defend what you've already decided. The whole Calvinist system seems to be one colossal example of rationalizing. That might even be called the theme of my essay.

• Re: "So, what about your faith? Is it a reaction to pain or a response to truth?" - This seems like a false dichotomy. Having seen other posts you make, I don't think this is your intent -- probably a wordsmithing issue.

I agree that, as written, it could be understood to imply that faith must be one or the other, either a reaction to pain or a response to truth, as if those categories are mutually exclusive and exhaustive. In reality, a person's faith could be influenced by both pain and truth, or may begin as one and mature into the other.

My intent was to elevate faith grounded in reason rather than to dismiss all emotional influence. I'll figure out a way to edit that paragraph to make my intent clearer.

Excellent input! That's just exactly the sort of thing I was hoping for when I posted it! Thank you!

I read a book a few years back called "Faith founded upon Fact" and it made very similar arguments to your post IIRC. I find the argument that we have a God who interacted in real history and therefore there is evidence of that to be an important truth. We aren't dealing with mythology (in the colloquial sense, not the academic sense), but with a Person who interacts with our universe in real time and real history.

Well that is just precisely the main point of my whole essay. You can't have a relationship with a being that you have nothing in common with.

I often wonder just what it is that Calvinists believe Genesis 1:27 actually means.

Have you seen the argument Scot McKnight makes that the `pistis` is better treated as "believing loyalty". I think such an interpretation is compatible with the kind of faith you are talking about (as opposed to blind faith) -- but would love to hear your thoughts on that.

Scot McKnight and others have proposed that the Greek word pistis should often be translated as “believing loyalty.” I think there is something to that, provided we understand the terms properly. Faith is not merely belief in the abstract, nor is it passive agreement with a set of facts. It is an act of reasoned trust, volitionally placed in a trustworthy Person, and lived out accordingly. In that sense, faith does include loyalty, not as a separate virtue added to belief, but as the natural outworking of what belief actually is when it is genuine.

Faith is not emotional whim, nor is it a blind leap. It is the rational decision to entrust oneself to Christ based on the reliability of His character and the evidence of His claims. That trust includes relational fidelity because it arises from a relationship. What McKnight calls “believing loyalty” is, in essence, just faith understood holistically, as a reasoned response that endures. As long as we keep that foundation clear, that faith is a decision grounded in truth and not a performance rooted in fear, then the language of allegiance can help clarify rather than confuse what faith truly is.

I would caution, however, that McKnight's doctrine seems to lean pretty heavily towards "Lordship Salvation" and the lever he used to push in that direction is this "believing loyalty" idea. And that would be fine if we were Messianic Jews and Jesus was our King but we are not and He is not. Christ is not our King (except in the larger context of the overall household of faith and that God is the King of all existence), He is our Head and we are members of the Body of Christ (i.e. not Israel). Our relationship with God is not national nor political nor corporate but personal and individual. Thus McKnight's linguistic point holds in the context of the Body of Christ in the sense that we are loyal to Christ as our God, as our Head, even as our Friend but not in any sense that would tend toward placing us under the law.

** I am in the software industry, and issues with reasoning capabilities are the cause of a whole slew of issues there.

You're at an advantage over most, I'd say. You're in an industry that trains your mind to be rigorously disciplined. You understand intuitively that there is no such thing as an irrational truth because you see first hand what happens when errors of logic are left uncorrected.

 

[torial]

Just a quick note - I will try to reply (but may take a few days, even half a week) -- I'm in the middle of a hard deadline w/ software validation for FDA application.

Those are some great insights -- and I really want to follow up on the Scot McKnight comments -- although if I get enough time, I may try to organize my thoughts that I have had re: Scot McKnight's take and the Kingdom of God and make a separate post and tag you for your feedback [that will take a while to consolidate into something coherent, so might be a few weeks out].

 

[VeritatisVerba]

Just a quick note - I will try to reply (but may take a few days, even half a week) -- I'm in the middle of a hard deadline w/ software validation for FDA application.

Those are some great insights -- and I really want to follow up on the Scot McKnight comments -- although if I get enough time, I may try to organize my thoughts that I have had re: Scot McKnight's take and the Kingdom of God and make a separate post and tag you for your feedback [that will take a while to consolidate into something coherent, so might be a few weeks out].

I look forward to it.

 

[jswauto]

How about some examples:

Faith Demonstrated

A young woman in my church is the daughter of a prominent physician, who at his death, bequeathed her a substantial fortune. The property, however, was involved in litigation. The daughter had no funds to fight the suit, but a lawyer, an old family friend, came to her assistance, advancing the required funds and himself taking the case.

At the end of a long trial, to their great surprise, a verdict was returned against them. She had lost all she had expected to possess and the sum advanced by the lawyer friend was also gone. Together they walked from the courthouse and went slowly down the street. After they had walked silently for some distance, the lawyer turned to the young woman.

Is anything wrong? He said. Aren’t you feeling well?

Why yes, of course, she replied. I feel perfectly well. Why do you ask?

He looked at her in astonishment. Don’t you realize what has happened? You have lost everything and are penniless! Yet you are not panicky or hysterical; you give no sign of going to pieces or are you even upset. Instead you are so calm I fear for you.

The young woman replied. Come over into the park to that bench and I will reply.

They crossed into the park and she said, You may not understand, but all through the trial I have prayed that God’s will should be done. I could not pray for victory for myself unless God wanted it so, and I have prayed that the trial should result according to His will. The verdict is against me and while I do not understand it, somehow I know it is God’s will and I accept it and feel only peace in my heart.

He looked at her in amazement, but saw only calmness and control written on her face. Her sincerity was impressive.

Months passed in which the young woman, who had expected ample resources, was compelled to struggle against adversity. But her sincere faith carried her through and she was able to support herself.

One night ia a dream she had the strong impression she should take the case to a higher court. She told he lawyer of her feelings, which persuaded him to reopen the case. After some weeks, a new verdict was handed down, this time in her favor. Moreover, she received substantially greater benefit than would have been granted had she won the first action. She walked out of court with her trusted friend, who turned to her and said, I have a new name for you. From now on you will be called; Little Miss Faith.

This young women’s desire and purpose was entirely spiritual. Her utter self-abnegation and completeness of personal surrender opened her nature to an unhindered flow of divine power.

The Praying Woman has Fallen

We have a wonderful God, a God whose ways are past finding out, and whose grace and power are limitless. I was in Belfast one day and saw one of the brethren of the assembly. He said to me, "Wigglesworth, I am troubled. I have had a good deal of sorrow during the past five months. I had a woman in my assembly who could always pray the blessing of heaven down on our meetings. She is an old woman, but her presence is always an inspiration. But five months ago she fell and broke her thigh.
The doctors put her into a plaster cast, and after five months they broke the cast. But the bones were not properly set and so she fell and broke the thigh again."
He took me to her house, and there was a woman lying in a bed on the right hand side of the room. I said to her, "Well, what about it now?" She said, "They have sent me home incurable. The doctors say that I am so old that my bones won't knit. There is no nutriment in my bones and they could never do anything for me and they say I shall have to lie in bed for the rest of my life." I said to her, "Can you believe
God?" She replied, "Yes, ever since I heard that you had come to Belfast my faith has been quickened. If you will pray, I will believe. I know there is no power on earth that can make the bones of my thigh knit, but I know there is nothing impossible with God." I said, "Do you believe He will meet you now?" She answered, "I do."
It is grand to see people believe God. God knew all about this leg and that it was broken in two places. I said to the woman, "When I pray, something will happen." Her husband was sitting there; he had been in his chair for four years and could not walk a step. He called out, "I don't believe. I won't believe. You will never get me to believe." I said, "All right," and laid my hands on his wife in the name of the Lord Jesus. The moment hands were laid upon her the power of God went right through her and she cried out, "I'm healed." I said, "I'm not going to assist you to rise. God will do it all." She rose and walked up anddown the room, praising God.
The old man was amazed, at what had happened to his wife, and he cried out, "Make me walk, make me walk." I said to him, "You old sinner, repent." He cried out, "Lord, You know I never meant what I said.
You know I believe." I don't think he meant what he said; anyhow the Lord was full of compassion. If He marked our sins, where would any of us be? If we will meet the conditions, God will always meet us. If we believe, all things are possible. I laid my hands on him and the power went right through the old man's body; and those legs, for the first time in four years, received power to carry his body, and he walked up and down and in and out. He said, "O what great things God has done for us tonight!"
"What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them."
Desire toward God, and you will have desires from God; and He will meet you on the line of those desires when you reach out in simple faith.

 

[jswauto]

A few more:

The baptism

After I had received the Baptism of the Holy ghost (and I know that I received; for the Lord gave me the
Spirit in just the same way as He gave Him to the disciples at Jerusalem), I sought the mind of the Lord
as to why I was baptized. One day I came home from work and went into the house and my wife asked
me, 'Which way did you come in?" I told her that I had come in at the back door. She said, "There is a
woman upstairs and she has brought an old man of eighty to be prayed for. He is raving up there and a
great crowd is outside the front door, ringing the door-bell and wanting to know what is going on in the
house." The Lord quietly whispered, "This is what I baptized you for."
I carefully opened the door of the room where the man was, desiring to be obedient to what my Lord
would say to me. The man was crying and shouting in distress, "I am lost! I am lost! I have committed
the unpardonable sin. I am lost! I am lost!" My wife said, "Dad, what shall we do?" The Spirit of the
Lord moved me to cry out, "Come out, thou lying spirit." In a moment the evil spirit went, and the Lord
said to me, "This is what I baptized you for."

The Old Classic: Dan 3

Nebuchadnezzar's Golden Image

1Nebuchadnezzar the king made an image of gold, whose height was threescore cubits, and the breadth thereof six cubits: he set it up in the plain of Dura, in the province of Babylon. 2Then Nebuchadnezzar the king sent to gather together the princes, the governors, and the captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counsellers, the sheriffs, and all the rulers of the provinces, to come to the dedication of the image which Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up. 3Then the princes, the governors, and captains, the judges, the treasurers, the counsellers, the sheriffs, and all the rulers of the provinces, were gathered together unto the dedication of the image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up; and they stood before the image that Nebuchadnezzar had set up. 4Then an herald cried aloud, To you it is commanded, O people, nations, and languages, 5That at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king hath set up: 6And whoso falleth not down and worshippeth shall the same hour be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace. 7Therefore at that time, when all the people heard the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and all kinds of musick, all the people, the nations, and the languages, fell down and worshipped the golden image that Nebuchadnezzar the king had set up.

Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego

8Wherefore at that time certain Chaldeans came near, and accused the Jews. 9They spake and said to the king Nebuchadnezzar, O king, live for ever. 10Thou, O king, hast made a decree, that every man that shall hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, shall fall down and worship the golden image: 11And whoso falleth not down and worshippeth, that he should be cast into the midst of a burning fiery furnace. 12There are certain Jews whom thou hast set over the affairs of the province of Babylon, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego; these men, O king, have not regarded thee: they serve not thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

13Then Nebuchadnezzar in his rage and fury commanded to bring Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. Then they brought these men before the king. 14Nebuchadnezzar spake and said unto them, Is it true, O Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, do not ye serve my gods, nor worship the golden image which I have set up? 15Now if ye be ready that at what time ye hear the sound of the cornet, flute, harp, sackbut, psaltery, and dulcimer, and all kinds of musick, ye fall down and worship the image which I have made; well: but if ye worship not, ye shall be cast the same hour into the midst of a burning fiery furnace; and who is that God that shall deliver you out of my hands?

16Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, answered and said to the king, O Nebuchadnezzar, we are not careful to answer thee in this matter. 17If it be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of thine hand, O king. 18But if not, be it known unto thee, O king, that we will not serve thy gods, nor worship the golden image which thou hast set up.

The Fiery Furnace

19Then was Nebuchadnezzar full of fury, and the form of his visage was changed against Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego: therefore he spake, and commanded that they should heat the furnace one seven times more than it was wont to be heated. 20And he commanded the most mighty men that were in his army to bind Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, and to cast them into the burning fiery furnace. 21Then these men were bound in their coats, their hosen, and their hats, and their other garments, and were cast into the midst of the burning fiery furnace. 22Therefore because the king's commandment was urgent, and the furnace exceeding hot, the flame of the fire slew those men that took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. 23And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, fell down bound into the midst of the burning fiery furnace.

24Then Nebuchadnezzar the king was astonied, and rose up in haste, and spake, and said unto his counsellers, Did not we cast three men bound into the midst of the fire? They answered and said unto the king, True, O king. 25He answered and said, Lo, I see four men loose, walking in the midst of the fire, and they have no hurt; and the form of the fourth is like the Son of God. 26Then Nebuchadnezzar came near to the mouth of the burning fiery furnace, and spake, and said, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, ye servants of the most high God, come forth, and come hither. Then Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, came forth of the midst of the fire. 27And the princes, governors, and captains, and the king's counsellers, being gathered together, saw these men, upon whose bodies the fire had no power, nor was an hair of their head singed, neither were their coats changed, nor the smell of fire had passed on them.

Healing is Regulated:

When I was in Switzerland the Lord was graciously working and healing many of the people. I was
staying with Brother Reuss of Goldiwil and two policemen were sent to arrest me. The charge was that I
was healing the people without a license. Mr. Reuss said to them, "I am sorry that he is not here just
now. He is holding a meeting about two miles away, but before you arrest him let me show you
something."
Brother Reuss took these two policemen down to one of the lower parts of that district, to a house with
which they were familiar, for they had often gone to that place to arrest a certain woman, who was
repeatedly put in prison because of continually being engaged in drunken brawls. He took them to this
woman and said to them, "This is one of the many cases of blessing that have come through the ministry
of the man you have come to arrest. This woman came to our meeting in a drunken condition. Her body
was broken, for she was ruptured in two places. While she was drunk, the evangelist laid his hands on
her and asked God to heal her and deliver her." The woman joined in, "Yes, and God saved me, and I
have not tasted a drop of liquor since." The policemen had a warrant for my arrest, but they said with
disgust, "Let the doctors do this kind of thing." They turned and went away and that was the last we
heard of them.

 

[VeritatisVerba]

@jswauto,

I appreciate the effort to share examples, but these stories actually highlight why I wrote what I did. Faith that rests on impressions, unverifiable anecdotes, or the assumption that every outcome is “God’s will” is not biblical faith. In fact, it is indistinguishable from pagan superstition. Some "white witch" with a talisman in her pocket could make similar claims and act in similar ways for similar reasons. The stories you tell are all but identical to the New Ager who carries a citrine crystal, which they call the “merchant’s stone” or “success stone”, believing it to attract wealth, abundance, and good fortune.

Real, biblical faith is not a leap into the unknown in hopes that God will arrange events our way. It is a reasoned trust grounded in the truth God has revealed about Himself, His character, and His promises. Abraham’s faith in Hebrews 11 was not a mystical feeling but a calculated confidence that God could raise the dead. Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego stood in the furnace not because they felt it would turn out well, but because they knew the God they served. Without that grounding in truth, “faith” is no more reliable than the story it hangs on and the transient emotional experience that story evokes.

John the Baptist, Stephen, and Paul were all men of immense faith, yet each was executed precisely because of that faith. The same is true of countless others throughout history. Polycarp, a disciple of the Apostle John, was burned (and then stabbed when he didn't die fast enough) for refusing to renounce Christ. William Tyndale, who labored to put Scripture into the hands of ordinary people, was strangled and burned. Dietrich Bonhoeffer was hanged by the Nazis for resisting tyranny. Jim Elliot and four other missionaries were speared to death on a riverbank in Ecuador. Entire Christian populations, such as the Armenians under the Ottoman Empire, have been wiped off the map for their loyalty to Jesus Christ. Things do not typically “work out” for those who have faith, except in the ultimate and eternal sense. Faith will not keep you from prison, save you from persecution, or put one bite of food in your mouth. What it will do is anchor you to the truth so that you can endure loss, pain, and even death without letting go of the One who is your life.

“He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose.” - Jim Elliot

 

[jswauto]

I actually considered listing Polycarp cause it's such a great example of faith in Jesus Christ. I know a couple of the examples weren't the greatest because they're more the category of miracle working. I chose these stories to go along with your explanation because of the simplicity of all the techniques involved. All just believed totally in the Lord and gave total control over to Him irregardless of the outcome.

 

[VeritatisVerba]

I actually considered listing Polycarp cause it's such a great example of faith in Jesus Christ. I know a couple of the examples weren't the greatest because they're more the category of miracle working. I chose these stories to go along with your explanation because of the simplicity of all the techniques involved. All just believed totally in the Lord and gave total control over to Him irregardless of the outcome.

Do you not see that your interpretation of these unverifiable stories is indistinguishable from superstition?

You list your religious affiliation as "Charismatic". I've had more than one charismatic believer tell me that Paul landed himself in prison because of a lack of faith. Their point specifically being that had he demonstrated proper faith, he'd have never gone to prison in the first place much less have been taken to Rome, never mind having been executed. The idea is that "faith" guarantees you health, wealth and happiness. If your circumstances are poor, its because your faith wasn't strong enough and that the cure for your bad circumstance is to name the thing you desire, proclaim that it is yours "in Jesus name" and believe that it is yours in spite of every bit of evidence to the contrary. That is NOT biblical! My own father-in-law is dead because of such dogma.

This sort of "faith" is superstition, not biblical faith. It's no different than trusting a rabbit’s foot kissed under a stepladder on the first of the moon.

Perhaps such was not your intended point, but that is how it reads.