Nursing mothers who pump at work

[Lamb]

There are a few nursing mothers who pump milk while at work. By law the company cannot force them in a bathroom to do this but our office has a room off to the side with a door for them to use and it has a vented type door so it's not very private soundwise.

One woman seems to take advantage of her legal time to pump while at work. She's there 3 times a day for well over an hour each time. Sometimes when she's done she'll call her kids and talk to them for a while.

Do you think it's fair for her to charge the client for the time she's pumping milk?

 

[Alithis]

Equality was once a huge catch phrase huh.
Is it not a weird dillema that once did not exist where the dependance on the need to work for income has become so great that these sort of questions are even asked?

 

[psalms 91]

No its not fair nor should be allowed

 

[Josiah]

There are a few nursing mothers who pump milk while at work. By law the company cannot force them in a bathroom to do this but our office has a room off to the side with a door for them to use and it has a vented type door so it's not very private soundwise.

One woman seems to take advantage of her legal time to pump while at work. She's there 3 times a day for well over an hour each time. Sometimes when she's done she'll call her kids and talk to them for a while.

Do you think it's fair for her to charge the client for the time she's pumping milk?

No, it's not "fair." And I think people who ABUSE "rights" (often hard fought for) are a selfish problem.


I once worked with a girl who took cirgarette brakes. About every hour. For about 10 minutes - sometimes longer. And it didn't matter WHAT she was doing, WHAT she was responsible for, WHAT was happening. "I NEED a cirgarett" cry seem to be some eternal, God-given, inalienable RIGHT to which none could forbid. It probably wasn't the hour or so of missed work that was the biggest problem, but WHEN she took these breaks - it often was disruptive and caused production problems. No one said anything, no one questioned her.


I'm NO prude. I'm all in favor of mothers being able to "milk" for their little one. I get it. I support it. And I have no problem with them doing it discretely - DISCRETELY - respectfully, covered. And THAT is what I've experienced, at the workplace and elsewhere. Moms seem to be pretty discrete about this, in MY limited experience. I support that. This goes not only for when she needs to "milk" but also when they are feeding junior. BUT, if she's using LONG, LONG periods of time for this at the work place - THAT is a problem. If there is a MEDICAL reason for why it takes her very long - maybe that should be conveyed (at least to her supervisor) but if she's using this just as a break from work.... yup, that's a problem. But what I suspect is happening is that the supervisor is a male and THUS cannot say anything, and this mom knows that. I call that ABUSE.


Where I work is VERY loose. We don't clock in or out - we don't even have hours when we are expected to be at the workplace. And we are welcome to work from home (my home computer connects to my work computer - 90% of the time, I can do my thing just as well from home as at the workplace, and I often do). No one cares if we're on the 'net (as long as it's not porn, lol). No one cares much how long lunch is. None of this matters much because what matters is our PRODUCTION, are we CONTRIBUTING to the team, the project. We pretty much evaluate EACH OTHER. Our "supervisor" notes what we ACCOMPLISHED. It's probably an unusual, atypical workplace. So the issues you present really don't apply here much. But I do remember that former situation and that girl who kept leaving - often at what seemed like the worse times, say when we were meeting and coordinating and discussing - to go smoke that cig. Which seemed to take her a long time.



.

 

[Brighten04]

Maybe some time limit should be imposed.Ten minutes on each breast should be sufficient if the woman is using a breast pump. Twice Per shift also should be enough to relieve pressure. Three times per shift at an hour each time is excessive.

 

[tango]

There are a few nursing mothers who pump milk while at work. By law the company cannot force them in a bathroom to do this but our office has a room off to the side with a door for them to use and it has a vented type door so it's not very private soundwise.

One woman seems to take advantage of her legal time to pump while at work. She's there 3 times a day for well over an hour each time. Sometimes when she's done she'll call her kids and talk to them for a while.

Do you think it's fair for her to charge the client for the time she's pumping milk?

It seems that there are always a few who take something that is reasonable and push it long past the point it should have broken, knowing that if anyone complains they can play the "but I've got a right to express" card. Sadly it seems that things that are a right can be pushed way past what any normal person would consider reasonable.

Whether it be expressing milk, stopping for a cigarette, going to the bathroom, having a quick chat at the water cooler, there are always a couple who think that the right to do something creates a right to take as long as they please. I once worked with a guy who seemed to spend at least an hour every day going to the bathroom. I get that some bodily functions take longer than others and sometimes digestive issues mean it takes longer than expected but when someone takes two or three bathroom visits of half an hour each, every day, you have to wonder just what's going on.

One problem with the question of how to charge things is that unless you're in the kind of profession that charges for time in very small increments (I've seen accountants and lawyers charge in six-minute increments) it's clearly silly to explicitly clock off to go to the bathroom and clock back on 2-3 minutes later. But if you're spending enough time that it makes a difference to someone's bill and you're not working on their account you shouldn't be charging them.

I don't subscribe to the view that's popular in some quarters that any personal activity at work is somehow stealing from your employer - I expect to be flexible in my working hours and expect a bit of flexibility from my employer in turn. If something goes wrong at 5:58 when I'm due to knock off at 6:00 then I realise I'm expected to fix it rather than just walk out the door figuring it can wait until tomorrow. At the same time I expect to be able to make personal phone calls and use the internet for personal things, within reason. It's that "within reason" that's the kicker, because once the trust that makes it work is lost then everybody loses.

 

[Rens]

Eeeeww I'm glad that when I got kids you got paid for 4 days and only had to work 2. I was just in time. Now they don't have that anymore. And dad gave cow milk the 2 days he took care, lovely.
All the complaints from people without kids you got. Lol I didn't care. My ex worked as a pastor and got paid nothing, so this way the government neatly provided for us.

 

[Lamb]

By law companies are forced to allow nursing mothers to have time to pump but it's up to the company to work it out with the individual if they receive payment during that time they're pumping. At least that's what I read when I googled. I'm not sure how current the article was.

My complaint though is that some of us at my company have to charge the client for our time. I don't think it's fair for the client to have to pay for her time to pump, if she's charging (I don't know). I think if the company agreed to give her time and promised to pay her that it should come from overhead and not be billed to someone else.

 

[psalms 91]

Lets face it everything is billed including the overhead, it is included in the clients price

 

[Lamb]

At the company I work at, overhead is probably billed into the estimates for each project, but only at certain rates. The client agrees to that estimate for paying. So when something like this comes up, is she billing over and beyond the estimate and not doing the work that the client expected?

 

[Stravinsk]

There are a few nursing mothers who pump milk while at work. By law the company cannot force them in a bathroom to do this but our office has a room off to the side with a door for them to use and it has a vented type door so it's not very private soundwise.

One woman seems to take advantage of her legal time to pump while at work. She's there 3 times a day for well over an hour each time. Sometimes when she's done she'll call her kids and talk to them for a while.

Do you think it's fair for her to charge the client for the time she's pumping milk?

By law companies are forced to allow nursing mothers to have time to pump but it's up to the company to work it out with the individual if they receive payment during that time they're pumping. At least that's what I read when I googled. I'm not sure how current the article was.

My complaint though is that some of us at my company have to charge the client for our time. I don't think it's fair for the client to have to pay for her time to pump, if she's charging (I don't know). I think if the company agreed to give her time and promised to pay her that it should come from overhead and not be billed to someone else.

I'm unclear as to what the companies employees are responsible for doing for their clients, but is the work of a sort that this time used to breastfeed actually hinder that work in some way?

 

[Lamb]

I don't know how she bills. I'm just wondering what people think if she IS billing the client and whether that is fair to do so?

 

[Stravinsk]

I don't know how she bills. I'm just wondering what people think if she IS billing the client and whether that is fair to do so?

Well, that sort of depends on whether the time used to breastfeed hinders in some way her work for the client. If she cannot perform certain duties for the client because the activity hinders it in some way, then yes - it is not fair to the client to be billed for such time. If the nature of the work she does for the client is unhindered by the activity, then, no.

 

[Lamb]

Yeah, she doesn't carry her laptop into the nursing room.

 

[tango]

By law companies are forced to allow nursing mothers to have time to pump but it's up to the company to work it out with the individual if they receive payment during that time they're pumping. At least that's what I read when I googled. I'm not sure how current the article was.

My complaint though is that some of us at my company have to charge the client for our time. I don't think it's fair for the client to have to pay for her time to pump, if she's charging (I don't know). I think if the company agreed to give her time and promised to pay her that it should come from overhead and not be billed to someone else.

In that case I'd say the internal ethics of the situation would also be determined by how efficiently this particular person worked when she wasn't pumping. I remember some years ago I worked for a consultancy firm and when I gave an internal estimate of four days of development time for a project they quoted 10 days to the client. Their reasoning was that I worked much faster than the client would expect and they were going to profit from hiring me, rather than the client getting all the benefits. Effectively they figured that because I worked faster than most people they increased my day-rate to our client base.

Is your objection that this woman is being paid excessive amounts to pump milk when she should be working, or that she might be billing that time to clients?

 

[tango]

I don't know how she bills. I'm just wondering what people think if she IS billing the client and whether that is fair to do so?

If she's spending three hours a day pumping and not working (and presumably maybe 5 hours a day working) then that's a lot of extra unproductive time if she is billing it to the client. At that kind of level I'd say she should either not bill it, or be a little more discreet about just how much time she is taking away from her duties. But in many ways if the client is happy with what they receive and what they pay it's not a problem.

 

[Lamb]

Is your objection that this woman is being paid excessive amounts to pump milk when she should be working, or that she might be billing that time to clients?

My objection in the thread concerns the client. In person I'm jealous that she spends a lot of time not working but still getting paid while I work very hard to the point I'm exhausted every evening.

 

[tango]

My objection in the thread concerns the client. In person I'm jealous that she spends a lot of time not working but still getting paid while I work very hard to the point I'm exhausted every evening.

The personal jealousy thing is easy to cope with, just slow down a little. I've often taken a 5-10 minute break just because I needed to clear my head and figured that if a smoker can take a break without any questions being asked then so can a non-smoker. Years ago I worked with an IT guy who referred to his "virtual cigarette break".

As for whether the client is being billed for the time spent pumping, unless you're involved in the billing cycle that's something probably best left between accounts payable and the client. If the client agrees to a job for a price and they get the job for the price it really doesn't matter whether the people working on the job are breaking their backs or putting their feet up. If the client is paying by the hour you'd hope they weren't being charged for several hours of milk pumping every day but that comes back to an issue between accounting and the client.

If management can bill the time to the client they may not care much about it, and I'd have thought they would take an interest if they knew that nearly half of the working day was taken up with pumping and they were paying for it. But if this one person gets to slack off and everyone else takes up the slack it's unlikely that management will ever know.

So I guess the question is whether you're sufficiently concerned about it to raise it with management.