- Feb 9, 2021
- Liverpool, England
- Religious Affiliation
- Marital Status
- Acceptance of the Trinity & Nicene Creed
This posting page returned in blues format.
But if I click on "Christian Theology" in the bolded tree near the top of the page, I am transferred to a "blank" page. (But "luckily" I was able to back arrow to this "blues" one.
Clicking on a different active CH tab, presented that existing page a different format with a brilliant white background. Clicking on the Pedrito option took me to what looks like the same "blank" page.
Connecting to yet another active CH tab presented the page in the "blues" format, but clicking on anything landed me on a "blank" page.
Connecting to CH afresh presents the "blues" page. When I log in, I end up on that same "blank" page.
I'm totally stuck. So thanks in advance.
This touces on an interesting subject I found - Generally, Protestants and Catholics have a different definition of what faith itself is.Works can precede faith. Believing is a work - mental work.
Depends on what kind of faith and what the faith is in.But not by faith alone.
Works can precede faith.
Believing is a work - mental work
...Baptism is God's work.
Baptism is God's work in us. It's not something I can do to myself. The language is passive "be baptized" meaning something is happening to us.
The Apostle Peter (Acts 2:38):
...be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ...
Mood = Imperative – a command to be obeyed and actioned by choice.
The Apostle Peter (Acts 10:48):
And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.
A command to be consciously actioned, once again.
Jesus the Saviour (Mark 16:16):
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
It would seem that professed belief has to be followed by a conscious, visible act to confirm it.
But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
I don’t think I’m prepared to argue with James.
In James 2:21, notice closely that James does not say that Abraham's work of offering up Isaac resulted in God accounting Abraham as righteous. The accounting of Abraham's faith as righteousness was made in Genesis 15:6, many years before his work of offering up Isaac recorded in Genesis 22. The work of Abraham did not have some kind of intrinsic merit to account him as righteous, but it showed or manifested the genuineness of his faith. That is the "sense" in which Abraham was "justified by works." He was shown to be righteous.Was not Abraham our father justified by works when he offered Isaac his son on the altar? You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
James 2:21,24 - Bible Gateway passage: James 2:21, James 2:24 - New King James Version
In James 2:21, notice closely that James does not say that Abraham's work of offering up Isaac resulted in God accounting Abraham as righteous. The accounting of Abraham's faith as righteousness was made in Genesis 15:6, many years before his work of offering up Isaac recorded in Genesis 22. The work of Abraham did not have some kind of intrinsic merit to account him as righteous, but it showed or manifested the genuineness of his faith. That is the "sense" in which Abraham was "justified by works." He was shown to be righteous.
In James 2:24, James is not using the word "justified" here to mean "accounted as righteous" but is shown to be righteous. James is discussing the evidence of faith (says-claims to have faith but has no works/I will show you my faith by my works - James 2:14-18) and not the initial act of being accounted as righteous with God. (Romans 4:2-3) Works bear out the justification that already came by faith.
In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims he has faith but has no works (to evidence his claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. So James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed by the individual is genuine.
Excellent post! We are saved through faith (rightly understood) in Christ alone.Depends on what kind of faith and what the faith is in.
Are we saved by intellectual faith that is a mental assent that Christ is who He says He is? Nope, even the demons believe that much
Are we saved by making a "profession of faith"? Nope, we profess things all the time that we don't really mean or understand.
Are we saved by faith in our piousness and goodness? Nope, that pretty much makes us pharisees
Are we saved by faith in our doctrinal purity? Nope, Our understandings are limited by human reasoning and human prejudice.
Are we saved by faith in our religion/taking sacraments/reading our bibles/participating in worship services? Nope, that is just replacing the Jewish law and sacrificial system with another law and system in which to earn God's favor by what we do.
I would say that we are saved by a faith (trust and belief) in Christ that comes from a work of the Holy Spirit that transforms our hearts and changes our affections so that we Love God and Love Others. That Love produces works of righteousness and mercy that helps spread the Gospel of Christ, shows the Love of God to the world, and give Glory to God for all He has done. We are saved by that kind of Faith alone. But that kind of faith is so transformative that evidence of God working in our heart shines on those around us.
I’m in the process of trying to learn this very thing, after years of being a Catholic and told to do this, and to do that.The Law is God's Holy Law. So works are anything we do to obtain salvation. We are all saved in the same way, "by grace through faith" and that faith is in Jesus and His act of salvation on the cross for the forgiveness of our sins.
I’m in the process of trying to learn this very thing, after years of being a Catholic and told to do this, and to do that.