experiencing God

NewCreation435 · Dec 6, 2019

I am curious if any of you have used either personally or in the churches you attend the "Experiencing God" material by Henry Blackaby and Claude King?
I went through it first about 25 years ago and thought it was really profound. One of Henry's sons was in my Sunday School class when I was in school years ago and he had glowing things to say about his dad. I worked through the workbook and video series with a group from the church.

For a sample of this book

https://read.amazon.com/kp/embed?as...linkCode=kpe&ref_=cm_sw_r_kb_dp_OEW6DbENSVS8M

zecryphon_nomdiv · Dec 6, 2019

jsimms435 said:
I am curious if any of you have used either personally or in the churches you attend the "Experiencing God" material by Henry Blackaby and Claude King?
I went through it first about 25 years ago and thought it was really profound. One of Henry's sons was in my Sunday School class when I was in school years ago and he had glowing things to say about his dad. I worked through the workbook and video series with a group from the church.

For a sample of this book

https://read.amazon.com/kp/embed?as...linkCode=kpe&ref_=cm_sw_r_kb_dp_OEW6DbENSVS8M

I have never heard of this material. Even when I wasn't a Lutheran, I never ran across this author.

tango · Dec 6, 2019

Never heard of it, but read through the sample and there's some interesting stuff in there.

I really liked the comments towards the end of the sample about how our response that something is impossible says something about our faith in God's power. It's true to say that if God calls us to do something, however outlandish, that he will make things happen as they need to happen. It's something I have to remind myself every once in a while - if something is God's will then as long as we are willing to follow we don't need to worry about the odds. If it really is God's will things might be humanly impossible but still come to pass, whether by a literal miracle or by something as apparently unremarkable as an administrative error.

Lamb · Dec 7, 2019

Reading through the sample it seems like there is a great deal of pep talk in how to better a relationship with God...as if God really isn't doing anything until WE start doing something on our part. That sounds really strange to me because in my experiences with God, it's often the opposite...I experience God greater when I'm actually not making the attempt but when He sees a need to show me.

So right off the bat I have disagreements with some of what the author says but not all. He says we experience God through His Word and with that I agree with wholeheartedly! But then he goes on to saying that about eternal life and how it's about experience and in doing so he really mucks it up a bit. It's not the experience that gives us eternal life. It's by grace through faith and faith is a gift from God, so we can't do anything to make eternal life more sound for us by trying to get closer to God. We're already His sheep. That's what the author really messes up when he puts people on a guilt trip for not having that experience with God in relationship that he's pushing when in fact the experience is there when we received faith by God giving it to us by His Word. God isn't sitting around waiting for us to get involved with Him. No. God is so active in our lives already and if we put our arrogant human pride aside we can get a glimpse of it.

tango · Dec 7, 2019

Lämmchen said:
Reading through the sample it seems like there is a great deal of pep talk in how to better a relationship with God...as if God really isn't doing anything until WE start doing something on our part. That sounds really strange to me because in my experiences with God, it's often the opposite...I experience God greater when I'm actually not making the attempt but when He sees a need to show me.

What I read in it was about when God calls us to do something. Maybe we can't do it in our own strength but if God calls us to go and we decide not to because we are afraid or because it just seems too difficult, then we speak volumes about our faith in God to make things happen. In a situation like that we have to move and trust God - if God calls us to be a missionary it doesn't work to sit back down in our recliner and figure "God's got this" and not actually do anything at all. If God calls us to attend seminary we have to actually enroll, show up to classes, take exams etc. Yes, there are times when we take the baby steps and God does the grunt work behind the scenes but unless we take the baby steps it's not going to happen - God isn't going to simply arrange for the seminary to mail our theology degree to us if all we did was shrug and say "hey, God's got this" as we spent another evening in our recliner.

So right off the bat I have disagreements with some of what the author says but not all. He says we experience God through His Word and with that I agree with wholeheartedly! But then he goes on to saying that about eternal life and how it's about experience and in doing so he really mucks it up a bit. It's not the experience that gives us eternal life. It's by grace through faith and faith is a gift from God, so we can't do anything to make eternal life more sound for us by trying to get closer to God. We're already His sheep. That's what the author really messes up when he puts people on a guilt trip for not having that experience with God in relationship that he's pushing when in fact the experience is there when we received faith by God giving it to us by His Word. God isn't sitting around waiting for us to get involved with Him. No. God is so active in our lives already and if we put our arrogant human pride aside we can get a glimpse of it.

I didn't get the sense that he was claiming that experience in this world was a prerequisite for eternal life, although I was more skimming than deeply reading it.

NewCreation435 · Dec 7, 2019

Lämmchen said:
Reading through the sample it seems like there is a great deal of pep talk in how to better a relationship with God...as if God really isn't doing anything until WE start doing something on our part. That sounds really strange to me because in my experiences with God, it's often the opposite...I experience God greater when I'm actually not making the attempt but when He sees a need to show me.

So right off the bat I have disagreements with some of what the author says but not all. He says we experience God through His Word and with that I agree with wholeheartedly! But then he goes on to saying that about eternal life and how it's about experience and in doing so he really mucks it up a bit. It's not the experience that gives us eternal life. It's by grace through faith and faith is a gift from God, so we can't do anything to make eternal life more sound for us by trying to get closer to God. We're already His sheep. That's what the author really messes up when he puts people on a guilt trip for not having that experience with God in relationship that he's pushing when in fact the experience is there when we received faith by God giving it to us by His Word. God isn't sitting around waiting for us to get involved with Him. No. God is so active in our lives already and if we put our arrogant human pride aside we can get a glimpse of it.

I think you missed the point. I will give you an example. I knew a lady back in 1988 who volunteered to teach children's VBS. She had never taught before, but felt God calling her to volunteer and took a step of faith and agreed to do it. I met her the day before VBS started and she was nervous. But, she was also trusting God to use her and took a step of faith. As a result children's lives were changed and she made an impact for Christ. Could she have resisted this calling from God? Yes. Was she passive? No. She had to actively join God in his work and agree to do it and take a step of faith. It wasn't so much an issue related to salvation, but it was an act of following God is a work he was already doing and being obedient. Can we resist God and refuse to do that work? Yes. We can and miss out on the blessings God has for us and quench his spirit. Believers do it everyday.
I want to be sensitive to God's voice as that lady was and know when he is calling me to do something and then have the courage to do it.
The author makes the point throughout the material that God is already at work and calls us to join Him in His work. It is not that we start something that God isn't already doing.

Lamb · Dec 7, 2019

jsimms435 said:
I think you missed the point. I will give you an example. I knew a lady back in 1988 who volunteered to teach children's VBS. She had never taught before, but felt God calling her to volunteer and took a step of faith and agreed to do it. I met her the day before VBS started and she was nervous. But, she was also trusting God to use her and took a step of faith. As a result children's lives were changed and she made an impact for Christ. Could she have resisted this calling from God? Yes. Was she passive? No. She had to actively join God in his work and agree to do it and take a step of faith. It wasn't so much an issue related to salvation, but it was an act of following God is a work he was already doing and being obedient. Can we resist God and refuse to do that work? Yes. We can and miss out on the blessings God has for us and quench his spirit. Believers do it everyday.
I want to be sensitive to God's voice as that lady was and know when he is calling me to do something and then have the courage to do it.
The author makes the point throughout the material that God is already at work and calls us to join Him in His work. It is not that we start something that God isn't already doing.

The title is Experiencing God. The author and even you have suggested that we experience God because WE are active and have to take that step. I experience God every day when He brings to mind His Word through the music of hymns and songs that contain His Word that are constantly in my head. I don't even have to try to achieve that experience because the Holy Spirit lives in me.

To suggest that we HAVE to do something or we won't experience God is not something I'd promote.

In our daily lives we'll have to make some choices and could they be the ones that God is guiding us to take to do His will? Absolutely. If we make the wrong choice does that mean we don't experience God? Nope. Look at Jonah and how God finally got His will to be done even when Jonah was fighting it.

As a believer I trust that God's will is going to be done through me because the Holy Spirit lives in me. I don't have to go out of my way all the time fretting about whether God is going to be pleased if I choose to go to choir practice or if I choose to go hang the Christmas greens at church.

I think you would do well on reading up on Vocations and how Lutherans perceive it since you have stated a few times on CH how you are concerned about serving God. Lutherans believe that through our vocations we daily serve God.

NewCreation435 · Dec 7, 2019

Lämmchen said:
The title is Experiencing God. The author and even you have suggested that we experience God because WE are active and have to take that step. I experience God every day when He brings to mind His Word through the music of hymns and songs that contain His Word that are constantly in my head. I don't even have to try to achieve that experience because the Holy Spirit lives in me.

To suggest that we HAVE to do something or we won't experience God is not something I'd promote.

In our daily lives we'll have to make some choices and could they be the ones that God is guiding us to take to do His will? Absolutely. If we make the wrong choice does that mean we don't experience God? Nope. Look at Jonah and how God finally got His will to be done even when Jonah was fighting it.

As a believer I trust that God's will is going to be done through me because the Holy Spirit lives in me. I don't have to go out of my way all the time fretting about whether God is going to be pleased if I choose to go to choir practice or if I choose to go hang the Christmas greens at church.

I think you would do well on reading up on Vocations and how Lutherans perceive it since you have stated a few times on CH how you are concerned about serving God. Lutherans believe that through our vocations we daily serve God.

I believe that also. I've always considered my work with families to be my ministry and calling. Does that mean it is the only thing God has called me to? Nope
I think using Jonah as an example was a poor choice on your part. Jonah experienced the disciplining hand of God because of his disobedience. Is that the way you want to experience God? The equivalent of being in a whale? I sure don't.

tango · Dec 7, 2019

Lämmchen said:
The title is Experiencing God. The author and even you have suggested that we experience God because WE are active and have to take that step. I experience God every day when He brings to mind His Word through the music of hymns and songs that contain His Word that are constantly in my head. I don't even have to try to achieve that experience because the Holy Spirit lives in me.

To suggest that we HAVE to do something or we won't experience God is not something I'd promote.

In our daily lives we'll have to make some choices and could they be the ones that God is guiding us to take to do His will? Absolutely. If we make the wrong choice does that mean we don't experience God? Nope. Look at Jonah and how God finally got His will to be done even when Jonah was fighting it.

As a believer I trust that God's will is going to be done through me because the Holy Spirit lives in me. I don't have to go out of my way all the time fretting about whether God is going to be pleased if I choose to go to choir practice or if I choose to go hang the Christmas greens at church.

I think you would do well on reading up on Vocations and how Lutherans perceive it since you have stated a few times on CH how you are concerned about serving God. Lutherans believe that through our vocations we daily serve God.

God got his will done through Jonah but only because Jonah eventually decided he would go to Ninevah and do what God told him.

I think there are two aspects here. I agree with the notion that we can experience God with or without us necessarily doing anything, and also concur that it's dangerous to regard our relationship with God as something that should be guided by experience. There are times I've felt that God is so distant it's as if he isn't there at all, but having such an experience doesn't mean God isn't there. The other aspect is that if God calls us to do something we have to actually step up and do it. God called Jonah, Jonah ran away, so God pretty much grabbed hold of him and pointed him in the right direction.

Personally I recently felt what I thought was a call to help with the kids at church. It's not something I've ever really been interested in doing (I've worked with teenagers before but generally not with the little ones) but figured I'd see what happens. It's a huge blessing, a blessing I'd have totally missed out if I'd ignored the call and figured Someone Else would do it. The sequence was clear - calling, then response, then blessing. The blessings only come after you respond to the call.

NewCreation435 · Dec 12, 2019

tango said:
God got his will done through Jonah but only because Jonah eventually decided he would go to Ninevah and do what God told him.

I think there are two aspects here. I agree with the notion that we can experience God with or without us necessarily doing anything, and also concur that it's dangerous to regard our relationship with God as something that should be guided by experience. There are times I've felt that God is so distant it's as if he isn't there at all, but having such an experience doesn't mean God isn't there. The other aspect is that if God calls us to do something we have to actually step up and do it. God called Jonah, Jonah ran away, so God pretty much grabbed hold of him and pointed him in the right direction.

Personally I recently felt what I thought was a call to help with the kids at church. It's not something I've ever really been interested in doing (I've worked with teenagers before but generally not with the little ones) but figured I'd see what happens. It's a huge blessing, a blessing I'd have totally missed out if I'd ignored the call and figured Someone Else would do it. The sequence was clear - calling, then response, then blessing. The blessings only come after you respond to the call.

One of the seven realities of experiencing God is that God's invitation for you to work with Him always leads you to a crisis of belief that requires faith and action. This is because often times when God calls us to do something it requires faith. If we trust in our own ability or skills we miss the point. God wants to do something that He gets the credit for not us. So, we have to decide like Moses did when he faced the burning bush if he would respond or not. Moses at first said that he was not eloquent of speech and started making excuses for why he wasn't the right person for the job. He experienced a crisis. But, eventually he was faithful to do it.

tango · Dec 12, 2019

jsimms435 said:
One of the seven realities of experiencing God is that God's invitation for you to work with Him always leads you to a crisis of belief that requires faith and action. This is because often times when God calls us to do something it requires faith. If we trust in our own ability or skills we miss the point. God wants to do something that He gets the credit for not us. So, we have to decide like Moses did when he faced the burning bush if he would respond or not. Moses at first said that he was not eloquent of speech and started making excuses for why he wasn't the right person for the job. He experienced a crisis. But, eventually he was faithful to do it.

I would take issue with the "always" I bolded above.

I don't dispute for a minute that God sometimes calls us to do things that appear to be humanly impossible. I've personally seen a few things work through in ways that were unexpected, to say the least. There are obviously times that God works in a situation in a way that leaves no doubt at all that God is due the praise rather than us. Like Moses, like endless battles in the Old Testament, and like many situations today.

At the same time I don't see any reason why God shouldn't call us to something that is within our own capabilities and bless us accordingly. When I got that sense that maybe I could help teach the kids the issue wasn't a question of whether I was capable of it, it was more a question of whether I wanted to do it. Having decided to step out (albeit a relatively small step) the blessings followed. Had I not taken that step the blessings wouldn't have come.

I don't doubt for a minute that the blessings that follow stepping out in absolute faith, attempting to do something that is impossible by just about any human measure, are abundantly greater. That doesn't in any way change the fact that we can also be blessed by taking initial small steps. Maybe the small steps are to prepare us for larger steps later, maybe they are just to fill a temporary need. For me agreeing to work with the kids at church it could be just a way of filling a gap pending another teacher. It could be a precursor to some kind of ministry, or it could just be that I'm going to teach the kids one week every month and nothing more. I'm sure God will show me the cards as and when I need to see them.

Lamb · Dec 12, 2019

jsimms435 said:
I believe that also. I've always considered my work with families to be my ministry and calling. Does that mean it is the only thing God has called me to? Nope
I think using Jonah as an example was a poor choice on your part. Jonah experienced the disciplining hand of God because of his disobedience. Is that the way you want to experience God? The equivalent of being in a whale? I sure don't.

Vocation is not just equivalent to career. Your vocations are also husband, uncle, friend, volunteer, etc... God will work through you through those vocations whether you think you need to decide to do them or not. Experiencing God doesn't mean we have to go out and hunt for Him because He's always with us (lo, I am with you always) and the Holy Spirit is constantly guiding us to do the good works He has planned for us and we will bear fruit. It's comforting to know that as Christians we aren't alone...He's there, actively working in us.

NewCreation435 · Dec 14, 2019

Lämmchen said:
Vocation is not just equivalent to career. Your vocations are also husband, uncle, friend, volunteer, etc... God will work through you through those vocations whether you think you need to decide to do them or not. Experiencing God doesn't mean we have to go out and hunt for Him because He's always with us (lo, I am with you always) and the Holy Spirit is constantly guiding us to do the good works He has planned for us and we will bear fruit. It's comforting to know that as Christians we aren't alone...He's there, actively working in us.

that's true. In many cases we don't have to go out and hunt for him. And many of us may know when God is calling us to do something for him. Whether it is to teach Sunday School or something else, but we can still resist it.

NewCreation435 · Dec 14, 2019

Lämmchen said:
Vocation is not just equivalent to career. Your vocations are also husband, uncle, friend, volunteer, etc... God will work through you through those vocations whether you think you need to decide to do them or not. Experiencing God doesn't mean we have to go out and hunt for Him because He's always with us (lo, I am with you always) and the Holy Spirit is constantly guiding us to do the good works He has planned for us and we will bear fruit. It's comforting to know that as Christians we aren't alone...He's there, actively working in us.

that's true. In many cases we don't have to go out and hunt for him. And many of us may know when God is calling us to do something for him. Whether it is to teach Sunday School or something else, but we can still resist it.

tango · Dec 14, 2019

jsimms435 said:
that's true. In many cases we don't have to go out and hunt for him. And many of us may know when God is calling us to do something for him. Whether it is to teach Sunday School or something else, but we can still resist it.

I suspect we resist it because it pushes us out of our comfort zones. A few months ago I spoke at church and talked about the way we can so easily create a god in our own image, and how such a god typically won't ask us to do anything we didn't already want to do.

Sometimes God may nudge us slightly out of our comfort zone but in a way that allows us to grow a little without taking any huge risks. The example I used of teaching the little ones at Sunday School seems much like this - not something I'd normally think to do but not particularly risky in any way. Of course God may drop something huge on us that makes us want to look at the heavens and ask "Are you serious?". Maybe one leads to another, and each progressive step simply prepares us for the next step. Working with the kids at church means I've had to get child abuse clearance and figure stuff about things like their attention spans and how to engage them. Maybe down the line there's something else coming that will use those things. Maybe there isn't, I guess time will tell.

My experience is that often the things God calls me to do end up being the things I really want to do, while also being the things that I'd have laughed at even the thought of doing just a few months previously. Things I'd never have thought to do, would never have thought I'd ever do but, after thought and prayer, concluded my response would be "If this is what you want for me, let it be so".

experiencing God

NewCreation435

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zecryphon_nomdiv

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tango

... and you shall live ...

Lamb

God's Lil Lamb

tango

... and you shall live ...

NewCreation435

Well-known member

Lamb

God's Lil Lamb

NewCreation435

Well-known member

tango

... and you shall live ...

NewCreation435

Well-known member

tango

... and you shall live ...

Lamb

God's Lil Lamb

NewCreation435

Well-known member

NewCreation435

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tango

... and you shall live ...