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    Christian Theology - Thread: Can the Faith of Parents Save Their Children?

    1. #1
      Josiah's Avatar
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      Can the Faith of Parents Save Their Children?

      .


      Can the Faith of Parents Save Their Children?


      IMO, no. Faith is the free gift of God given personally and individually, the free gift of God that embraces the mercy and grace and blessings of God. Faith is like the hand that receives the gift. But no, it cannot receive a gift for OTHERS (whether a child or anyone else).


      HOWEVER.....



      The faith of parents CAN be the reason their child is blessed.


      Consider a biblical example. the last of the "Ten Plagues" (Exodus 11 - 12).


      Now remember, this would be a KEYSTONE event for the Hebrews and is seen by Christians as also a type of Christ and the Cross....

      God's JUDGEMENT (the Law) is that the first born of of people and animals would die.

      God's SALVATION (the Gospel) is that there is a way for the faithful to avoid this for their firstborn child (regardless of age)...

      The PARENTS are instructed to take a "spotless lamb" (which Christians view as a type of Christ), it is to killed (without bones broken), and the blood placed on the door frames of their house. Christians see all of this as types and as very important!

      When God "sees" that the parents believed and did as instructed, THEIR CHILD would be saved, THEIR CHILD would live.

      This event - which the Jewish Passover commemorates to this day - is all about God responding to the faith of the PARENTS by saving their CHILD (regardless of age).

      Now note, the child need not believe or do anything at all - whether the child be one hour hold or 80 years old - the entire blessing is in response to the faith of the PARENTS, faith that believes and obeys.

      Did the faith of the parents save their child? Technically, no. But the faith of the parents was the reason God saved their child.

      This event - SO important to both Jews and Christians - is rich and wonderful and very stressed, with several important truths. But this is ONE of them: God can bless children BECAUSE OF THE FAITH OF THE PARENTS.


      Agree?



      .
      We are justified by works - just not our own.

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    3. #2
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      Quote Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
      .


      Can the Faith of Parents Save Their Children?


      IMO, no. Faith is the free gift of God given personally and individually, the free gift of God that embraces the mercy and grace and blessings of God. Faith is like the hand that receives the gift. But no, it cannot receive a gift for OTHERS (whether a child or anyone else).


      HOWEVER.....



      The faith of parents CAN be the reason their child is blessed.


      Consider a biblical example. the last of the "Ten Plagues" (Exodus 11 - 12).


      Now remember, this would be a KEYSTONE event for the Hebrews and is seen by Christians as also a type of Christ and the Cross....

      God's JUDGEMENT (the Law) is that the first born of of people and animals would die.

      God's SALVATION (the Gospel) is that there is a way for the faithful to avoid this for their firstborn child (regardless of age)...

      The PARENTS are instructed to take a "spotless lamb" (which Christians view as a type of Christ), it is to killed (without bones broken), and the blood placed on the door frames of their house. Christians see all of this as types and as very important!

      When God "sees" that the parents believed and did as instructed, THEIR CHILD would be saved, THEIR CHILD would live.

      This event - which the Jewish Passover commemorates to this day - is all about God responding to the faith of the PARENTS by saving their CHILD (regardless of age).

      Now note, the child need not believe or do anything at all - whether the child be one hour hold or 80 years old - the entire blessing is in response to the faith of the PARENTS, faith that believes and obeys.

      Did the faith of the parents save their child? Technically, no. But the faith of the parents was the reason God saved their child.

      This event - SO important to both Jews and Christians - is rich and wonderful and very stressed, with several important truths. But this is ONE of them: God can bless children BECAUSE OF THE FAITH OF THE PARENTS.


      Agree?



      .
      Can we make a legitimate connection to being physically saved by a parents actions and being spiritually saved by a parents actions? I don't think so.
      Therefore, I think your attempt to connect the Passover with spiritual salvation is a mighty stretch.
      You accurately state that the parents God-given faith cannot save their children. (This is why infant baptism does nothing to save a child) Yet, a faithful parent will be dedicated to raising up a child and training a child to know about the God who gave the parent faith, by grace. God may use that daily witness and the prayers of that parent to graciously grant faith to the child. God may not. God may have other plans. We are not privy to the mind of God, nor do we know his plans.
      We offer our children to God. (I did this immediately upon the birth of my children.) We trust them to God to do as He deems wise. We leave them in the hands of God. We obey God in training our children. God, however, is the Sovereign chooser for their souls.

    4. #3
      psalms 91's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      Can we make a legitimate connection to being physically saved by a parents actions and being spiritually saved by a parents actions? I don't think so.
      Therefore, I think your attempt to connect the Passover with spiritual salvation is a mighty stretch.
      You accurately state that the parents God-given faith cannot save their children. (This is why infant baptism does nothing to save a child) Yet, a faithful parent will be dedicated to raising up a child and training a child to know about the God who gave the parent faith, by grace. God may use that daily witness and the prayers of that parent to graciously grant faith to the child. God may not. God may have other plans. We are not privy to the mind of God, nor do we know his plans.
      We offer our children to God. (I did this immediately upon the birth of my children.) We trust them to God to do as He deems wise. We leave them in the hands of God. We obey God in training our children. God, however, is the Sovereign chooser for their souls.
      Not a stretch at all Menno, can you not see the correlation between God leading his people out of Egypt to the promised land with salvation? You should look at the Jewish things closer as there is much to be learned by doing so
      Isaiah 40:31

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      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      You accurately state that the parents God-given faith cannot save their children. (This is why infant baptism does nothing to save a child)
      That line is a good example of a non-sequitur, isn't it?

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      Quote Originally Posted by psalms 91 View Post
      Not a stretch at all Menno, can you not see the correlation between God leading his people out of Egypt to the promised land with salvation? You should look at the Jewish things closer as there is much to be learned by doing so
      The Passover shows God's physical deliverance of His chosen people. Jesus changed the seder meal and showed how his sacrifice gave spiritual deliverance to His chosen people. This is why disciples of Christ remember Jesus body, given for them and his shed blood that atones for the disciples sins. God is patient with people so that they might believe, but they are held individually accountable. The actions of the body of Christ will not save the children who are dead in their trespasses and sins. Only God, by his faith giving grace, can save them.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Albion View Post
      That line is a good example of a non-sequitur, isn't it?
      That line is a good example of a teaching that doesn't save anyone.

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    10. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      That line is a good example of a teaching that doesn't save anyone.
      Which teaching is that--faith or baptism?

      You started with one of them and ended the thought with the other one.

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      Quote Originally Posted by Albion View Post
      Which teaching is that--faith or baptism?

      You started with one of them and ended the thought with the other one.
      If you are clueless, I cannot help you.

    12. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      If you are clueless, I cannot help you.
      It appears that you cannot help anyone with an explanation about that confused sentence you wrote in post #2.


      Its all right, though. I didn't think you had one anyway. It was just an outside chance.

    13. #10
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      Well then, there is this - The Conversion of the Jailer

      The Philippian Jailer Converted

      Act 16:25-34
      And at midnight Paul and Silas prayed, and sang praises unto God:
      and the prisoners heard them.
      And suddenly there was a great earthquake,
      so that the foundations of the prison were shaken:
      and immediately all the doors were opened,
      and every one's bands were loosed.

      And the keeper of the prison awaking out of his sleep,
      and seeing the prison doors open,
      he drew out his sword,
      and would have killed himself,
      supposing that the prisoners had been fled.

      But Paul cried with a loud voice, saying,
      Do thyself no harm:
      for we are all here.
      Then he called for a light,
      and sprang in,
      and came trembling,
      and fell down before Paul and Silas,
      And brought them out, and said,
      "Sirs, what must I do to be saved?"

      And they said,
      "Believe unto the Lord Jesus Christ,
      and thou shalt be saved,
      and thy house.

      And they spake unto him the word of the Lord,
      and to all that were in his house.
      And he took them the same hour of the night,
      and washed their stripes;
      and was baptized,
      he and all his,
      straightway.

      And when he had brought them into his house,
      he set meat before them,
      and rejoiced,
      believing in God with all his house.


      Now had that jailer simply said:
      "Thank you for not escaping -
      Please re-confine yourselves
      so that you may be turned over
      tomorrow morning to the Judge..."
      Would his House have been converted and saved?

      We can say, you see, that his conversion saved his house, and we can say that he saved his house by his conversion...
      And all this is true, in a manner of speaking...
      His house in indebted to him for their Salvation...
      Households and families are the basis of much that Christ discipled...

      We can call this tribalism, and in a certain way it is...
      Yet what is a tribe but families and households united...
      And that unity is what Christ wants for us in Him...
      So that Salvation is a social event as well a private one...

      Because God is a UNITY of Three Persons [Hypostases]
      And we in Christ are a unity of many persons...
      Not in the mere verbal sense of believing the Bible...
      But ontologically in reality as members of His Body...


      Arsenios

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