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    Christian Theology - Thread: Sharing statements on Christian theology

    1. #1
      FredVB's Avatar
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      Sharing statements on Christian theology

      I want to share that though there are hidden things to be found out in the revelation from Yahweh, there are the basic essentials that all who become believers should know, that are shown in a straightforward way.

      Free will in our choices is a reality. Over and over we are told in scripture that we are to choose, for something in godliness.

      In the second epistle of Peter, it is said that God is not willing that any would perish but that all would come to repentance with which there is salvation, with Christ. Not all do, certainly, with being the case from free will. Coming to this is the narrow way, that is with coming to Christ, most choose in resisting that, even if with considering another way right, still.

      So Christ did not limit what was paid for. As being infinite God with the value being paid, the eternity for the redeemed is dealt wirh. That is not limited. With what is truly infinite, there is always more available with it. There could be any number more included with the redeemed, if the chose for it with responding as they should to God's work of grace toward them.

      The unlimitedness of God is unequaled, and there is no way those who stay in the godliness with Christ are going to be overcome from any power of Satan. There is nothing to fear of it with staying faithful to God and what is of God's will, in Christ, though there are times of adversity in life.

      The original gospel is about this godliness. There must be repentance from all that was going contrary to God's will, and trusting Jesus as Christ, to follow him, knowing that with his resurrection, we are raised redeemed with him. We then don't do things knowingly apart from God's will for us, but would seek it out more, doing accordingly. Nothing of this will reason away anything God states. So in this original gospel, we don't look to traditions to override what we may see for what God's will is for us.

      That in this year there are yet more people with the view that the earth is flat is unjustified from real basis, the Bible that some of those use to conclude that way does not give anything for that view conclusively. We can still say the sun sets, as an expression for that appearance, while still having the understanding that the earth rotates and where we are on it moves away from seeing the sun that where we are was facing. The circle of the earth is mentioned in the scriptures too. That the lunar eclipse shows the shadow of the earth, between it and the sun, always shows the curve of the earth, every time, from whichever direction it is seen, shows that the earth is curved all the way around. And friends online can be referred to for knowing the times where they are, showing the time zones correspond to the spherical earth.

      Happy 2019. Let us go forward and not backward.

    2. #2
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      Now I don't believe I agree with you at all about free will and man being able to choose holiness since man wants to be his own god like Adam and Eve and that reigns in us until we're given faith and then it's not a choosing but it's that we're already there with God. Ya know?

      I do agree with you entirely that the earth is not a flat earth and that stuff is absolutely ridiculous when we have videos and photos proving otherwise so its a matter of suspicion overriding facts.
      If you want to rile people up then go to a Christian site and give God ALL the glory for your salvation.

    3. #3
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      Quote Originally Posted by FredVB View Post
      Over and over we are told in scripture that we are to choose, for something in godliness.

      Who is the "we?" What is the "choice?" IF you are talking about CHRISTIANS (those justified, that is, those with the divine gift of spiritual life - the Holy Spirit - faith in Christ as Savior).... "choosing" to live out the life they have, living according to the leading of the Spirit, then yup. IF you are talking about dead, atheistic, enemies of God "choosing" to give self life, then I disagree.




      In the second epistle of Peter, it is said that God is not willing that any would perish but that all would come to repentance with which there is salvation, with Christ. Not all do, certainly, with being the case from free will.

      There is no free will. The dead can't will anything. Life is the gift of God. Faith is the gift of God.

      Just because God commands something doesnt necessarily mean that is something the precedes justification (life - faith - Holy Spirit) and something dead, atheistic enemies of God can (or will) do. There ain't much dead people can do.




      The unlimitedness of God is unequaled, and there is no way those who stay in the godliness with Christ are going to be overcome from any power of Satan. There is nothing to fear of it with staying faithful to God and what is of God's will, in Christ, though there are times of adversity in life.

      Yup.


      The original gospel is about this godliness. There must be repentance from all that was going contrary to God's will, and trusting Jesus as Christ, to follow him, knowing that with his resurrection, we are raised redeemed with him. We then don't do things knowingly apart from God's will for us, but would seek it out more, doing accordingly. Nothing of this will reason away anything God states. So in this original gospel, we don't look to traditions to override what we may see for what God's will is for us.

      Um..... depends if you are talking about justification or sanctification...

      No, we are not justified by repenting (making Jesus irrelevent and self the savior of self by good works). Nope, Jesus is the Savior. His atonement is apprehended via the divine gift of faith. Jesus saves, not self. The Cross /Empty Tomb is the cause, not self jumping through some hoop.




      That in this year there are yet more people with the view that the earth is flat is unjustified from real basis, the Bible that some of those use to conclude that way does not give anything for that view conclusively. We can still say the sun sets, as an expression for that appearance, while still having the understanding that the earth rotates and where we are on it moves away from seeing the sun that where we are was facing. The circle of the earth is mentioned in the scriptures too. That the lunar eclipse shows the shadow of the earth, between it and the sun, always shows the curve of the earth, every time, from whichever direction it is seen, shows that the earth is curved all the way around. And friends online can be referred to for knowing the times where they are, showing the time zones correspond to the spherical earth.

      I don't hold to a small, flat, square Earth.

      But I do realize a LOT of crazy ideas are out there, all by some individual Christian with ENORMOUS egos believing they alone are smart, they alone know what God should have said in the Bible but didn't, they alone determine what God MEANT or SHOULD believe. Egoism and individualism are at HUGE levels today.... and the result is amazing (and dangerous). Luther said that humility is the foundation of all good theology but there's precious little of that in the modern world - including among Christians.
      We are justified by works - just not our own.

    4. #4
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      sigh, God allows us to choose either to accept Him or not very clear in scripture or else should we start ripping them out of the bible
      Isaiah 40:31

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      Quote Originally Posted by psalms 91 View Post
      sigh, God allows us to choose either to accept Him or not very clear in scripture or else should we start ripping them out of the bible
      Read John 17 because God/Jesus disagrees with you. But...perhaps you are just ripping passages out of the Bible...

    6. #6
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      Read John 3:16 and so many other passages, by the way are you claiming that God plays favorites and not everyone has the opportunity for salvation? If so you are really going against scripture. Of course I know I wont change your mind and you definitely wont change mine since I know you are wrong and I doubt anyone elses so is this just for the sake of argument?
      Isaiah 40:31

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      Quote Originally Posted by psalms 91 View Post
      Read John 3:16 and so many other passages, by the way are you claiming that God plays favorites and not everyone has the opportunity for salvation? If so you are really going against scripture. Of course I know I wont change your mind and you definitely wont change mine since I know you are wrong and I doubt anyone elses so is this just for the sake of argument?
      I have read the entire Bible. I don't find free-will taught anywhere.
      God tells us that no one seeks God, not even one. Since no one can save themselves, God chooses whom He wills to save. Do you think God is evil for saving some and not all?
      Do you wish that God had dropped the gift of salvation on a main Street and those smart enough or lucky enough to unwrap the gift would be saved while all who walked past just died?
      When you give a gift, do you tell the person that it is for them or do you just leave it on the sidewalk and hope they find it? Are you an evil person because you give a gift to someone you have chosen rather than giving your entire country a gift they are required to run around and find? Don't you play favorites when you give a gift? Not everyone gets a gift from you...do they?
      Of course I know I wont change your mind since I know you are wrong so is this just for the sake of argument?

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      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      I have read the entire Bible. I don't find free-will taught anywhere.
      God tells us that no one seeks God, not even one. Since no one can save themselves, God chooses whom He wills to save. Do you think God is evil for saving some and not all?
      Do you wish that God had dropped the gift of salvation on a main Street and those smart enough or lucky enough to unwrap the gift would be saved while all who walked past just died?
      When you give a gift, do you tell the person that it is for them or do you just leave it on the sidewalk and hope they find it? Are you an evil person because you give a gift to someone you have chosen rather than giving your entire country a gift they are required to run around and find? Don't you play favorites when you give a gift? Not everyone gets a gift from you...do they?
      Of course I know I wont change your mind since I know you are wrong so is this just for the sake of argument?
      I will leaver you to it since this is pointless but one last thing. God has foreknowledge of the choices we will make so He isnt really choosing against our will but because of our will. We are predestined by His foreknowledge of what we will do and God uses that to shape His will in the world. Not hard at all and not rocket science
      Isaiah 40:31

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      Quote Originally Posted by psalms 91 View Post
      I will leaver you to it since this is pointless but one last thing.
      God has foreknowledge of the choices we will make
      so He isnt really choosing against our will but because of our will.
      Well, you have no scripture for the second assertion. Moreso, can you not see that your statement places God's will as subservient to your will? Read what you just wrote because you have glorified yourself while taking glory away from God.
      We are predestined by His foreknowledge of what we will do and God uses that to shape His will in the world.
      Your statement is a convoluted pretzel with no biblical support. God is not held back from acting until we first choose. That places God as subservient to us.
      It is also the philosophy of open theists and liberals who deny God's Sovereignty. Do you really want to go down the path of liberalism?

      Not hard at all and not rocket science
      Well, since your biblical support is empty, I would say that at least rocket science has empirical data to back itself up. What you have is just post-modern feelings where opinion is valued over facts.

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      Quote Originally Posted by psalms 91 View Post
      I will leaver you to it since this is pointless but one last thing. God has foreknowledge of the choices we will make so He isnt really choosing against our will but because of our will. We are predestined by His foreknowledge of what we will do and God uses that to shape His will in the world. Not hard at all and not rocket science



      @psalms 91


      The Bible does NOT say that God only FOREKNOWS. It says He also PREDESTINES or ELECTS. There is a difference.


      To foreknow simply means to be aware of something before it happens. It has NOTHING WHATSOEVER to do with causing it or desiring it. Of course, for God (alone) such is perfect and for man, it's not. But yes, in a limited way, I FOREKNOW the sun will rise tomorrow (I can even look up and tell you EXACTLY when it will happen where I live). But I have NOTHING to do with it. It's not necessarily my will or the response to ANYTHING in me. Did God foreknow that the devil would rebell? Yes. Did God know that Eve would pick that walnut? Yup. What does this imply? Only one thing, He KNEW.

      To predestine or elect means to cause. Lazarus was raised from the dead. Why? Because Jesus performed a miracle and it resulted in Lazarus coming to life. Did God FOREKNOW Lazarus would? Sure, but this foreknowledge had nothing to do with it actually happening. It was His election that brought about the miracle. Did God CAUSE the devil to rebel? No (although He did foreknow it). Did God CAUSE Eve to pic that orange? Nope (unless one is LDS), but He did foreknow it. Do I foreknow that my son will poop in his pants? Yup. Am I the cause of it? Nope. Thus, I can say I have foreknowledge on that, but NOT that I predestine it.


      Thing is, Bill, the Bible does NOT say that God ONLY foreknows who will and will not save themselves by performing the good work of choosing Him. He DOES say he foreknows who will and won't have faith, but it doesn't ONLY say that. Far more often, the Bible says that God ELECTS or CHOOSES or PREDESTINES who will believe.... and the very word means He causes it, He brings it about. This "fits" perfectly with MANY Scriptures that indicate that faith is "the free gift of God" and "no one can even say 'Jesus is Lord' unless the Holy Spirit causes" and "you did not choose me but I choose you" and "salvation is the free gift of God and not by what you do, lest anyone have a reason to boast of themselves." Now, Bill, there IS mystery here (to use a favorite word in Lutheran theology).... and it seems very likely that part of God's miracle is changing our will (but God doing the CHANGING).... how God DOES this miracle of giving spiritual life, giving the Holy Spirit, giving faith in Christ ("the free gift of God") is largely unknown, largely mystery. But it is not simply "God knows who will perform the good work of choosing Jesus and THUS gives them faith." (See PS below)


      There is a tendency among radical Calvinists and Arminianists to think that if "A" is wrong, thus the logical extreme opposite MUST be correct. It's a false approach - especially when it runs head on with an abundance of Scriptures that verbatim say the exact opposite. SOMETIMES, friend, we end up with a mystery... a reality we can't fully wrap our fallen, puny, human brains around. We are called to be "Stewards of the MYSTERIES of God" not to correct God. There IS foreknowledge... but there is also predestination of the believers.


      I hope that helps....


      A blessed Epiphany season to all!



      - Josiah



      PS I reject predestination of the damned (a position of only a very few HYPER-Calvinists). God FOREKNOWS who will not have faith but God doesn't CAUSE that. God desires all to be saved (as the Bible repeatedly says).... Christ died for all (as the Bible repeatedly says).... God causes some to believe..... Now, stop where God Himself does. The Bible ONLY says that God predestines some TO believe. And it says that ONLY as pure Gospel, to comfort and assure the saved. Don't twist that upside down and inside out, don't twist that into terrorizing Law as the HYPER, radical Calvinists do. Don't FORCE God to agree with the "logic" of self. Just accept what God says... and realize, God performs a MIRACLE here, the MIRACLE of life and faith, the MIRACLE of justification. And we don't know all the pieces of the puzzle, we don't know all the 'dots' so don't try to connect them. I accept positive predestination because the Bible says that, I reject the opposite because the Bible doesn't teach that (it teaches the exact opposite). Lutherans approach theology with HUMILITY. It does, at times, leave us with mystery.





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      Last edited by Josiah; 01-07-2019 at 12:30 PM.
      We are justified by works - just not our own.

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