American Churches dying

[Particular]

I'm reading a book by Jonathan Leeman entitled, Church Membership. In the first chapter he likens the local church to a nations embassy, meaning that the church is the embassy of the Kingdom of God. When people walk into an embassy, they are walking into the nation which that embassy represents.
This means that people don't come to church as customers at an entertainment venue. They come because they are citizens of the Kingdom and in the Embassy they meet with fellow citizens to enjoy the benefits of citizenship and hear what the King has declared.
This book is changing my view of church.
https://www.crossway.org/books/church-membership-case/

 

[NewCreation435]

I'm reading a book by Jonathan Leeman entitled, Church Membership. In the first chapter he likens the local church to a nations embassy, meaning that the church is the embassy of the Kingdom of God. When people walk into an embassy, they are walking into the nation which that embassy represents.
This means that people don't come to church as customers at an entertainment venue. They come because they are citizens of the Kingdom and in the Embassy they meet with fellow citizens to enjoy the benefits of citizenship and hear what the King has declared.
This book is changing my view of church.
https://www.crossway.org/books/church-membership-case/

looks like an interesting book. Thanks

 

[Josiah]

I'm reading a book by Jonathan Leeman entitled, Church Membership. In the first chapter he likens the local church to a nations embassy, meaning that the church is the embassy of the Kingdom of God. When people walk into an embassy, they are walking into the nation which that embassy represents.
This means that people don't come to church as customers at an entertainment venue. They come because they are citizens of the Kingdom and in the Embassy they meet with fellow citizens to enjoy the benefits of citizenship and hear what the King has declared.
This book is changing my view of church.

... well, they SHOULD so come....

 

[Michael]

An interesting passage we find in Acts, that shows us there is a big difference between those in the Body of Christ and those in the churches. We've made the terms synonymous, but they are not.


"through the hands of the apostles many signs and wonders were done among the people. And they were all with one accord in Solomon’s Porch. 13 Yet none of the rest dared join them, but the people esteemed them highly. 14 And believers were increasingly added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women." - Acts 5:12-14

Truly, when the Body of Christ is coming to maturity, and being transformed into the "image of the Son of God", then people will believe and be added to the churches.

"For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly waits for the revealing of the sons of God." - Rom 8:19


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[Albion]

An interesting passage we find in Acts, that shows us there is a big difference between those in the Body of Christ and those in the churches. We've made the terms synonymous, but they are not.


"through the hands of the apostles many signs and wonders were done among the people. And they were all with one accord in Solomon’s Porch. 13 Yet none of the rest dared join them, but the people esteemed them highly. 14 And believers were increasingly added to the Lord, multitudes of both men and women." - Acts 5:12-14

Truly, when the Body of Christ is coming to maturity, and being transformed into the "image of the Son of God", then people will believe and be added to the churches.

"For the earnest expectation of the creation eagerly waits for the revealing of the sons of God." - Rom 8:19


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Even the verse you selected to prove your point begins by saying that these people were reached by the preaching of the Apostles, but your position seems to be that the last place one is likely to hear the Gospel is in a church with a pastor. We all recognize that in every congregation there are sheep and also goats, but that doesn't mean that churches are pointless or worse.

 

[Michael]

Even the verse you selected to prove your point begins by saying that these people were reached by the preaching of the Apostles, but your position seems to be that the last place one is likely to hear the Gospel is in a church with a pastor. We all recognize that in every congregation there are sheep and also goats, but that doesn't mean that churches are pointless or worse.

Oh, I agree that it is by preaching the Gospel that we all, that you, and I, were reached. Amen.

The Gospel is to preached outside the churches, not necessarily inside. That is the gift of the Evangelist, to awaken "dead" people to the hope that there is something beyond this life in which we live now. They can realize that they no longer have to be bound by sin. To join a church (religious organization) is fine, and costs nothing. But to enter into the Church, the Body of Christ will cost us everything. Personally, from my experience with congregations around this nation over the past 20 years now, I have found that very few believe or understand that Truth which Jesus and the Apostles taught. Back then, the people knew the cost, and that is why few "dared to join the Apostles." They were fine with attending gatherings, but were not yet willing to "deny themselves, pick up their cross and follow Jesus", be "baptized into His death", and "present their bodies a living sacrifice."

I pray each one of us is a part of an assembly; but far more importantly, that we are doing the things necessary to become a member of the body of Christ.

Peace & Blessings.

 

[Jason76]

WHY Christianity and the church is declining is a complex and difficult issue....

WHAT Christians and churches should do to reverse this is also complex....


There are churches that work HARD to be as worldly, as world-like as they can. I think this lies behind so much of "contemporary" worship, pastors in their Ahola shirts and jeans, churches with coffee shops, etc. I strongly question if making Christianity as secular, as worldly, as much a part of the culture is the best approach - or if perhaps it's counter productive. On the other hand, there is often wisdom in "coming along side" those we wish to "win" and removing needless barriers. Perhaps there's a balance here....


I know MANY who first were "churched" by some "Lite" "evangelical" rock-and-roll mega church - and very quickly left, looking for meat and not sugar water; some of these wander into historic churches (Catholic, Lutheran, Reformed...), a lot just drop out (these churches GAIN a lot, and LOOSE a lot) and some settle for the sugar-water. Yeah, I know of the leadership principle of "coming along side" BUT the principle continues "but don't leave them there!" IMO, some churches are good at the first part and entirely clueless about the second because that's all the church has.


Personally, I grew up in the church. I've been a Christian and very active in the church from birth. And it was a very rich spiritual and theological milieu (Catholic). I grew up with the liturgy and with an understanding and deep appreciation for all the theology and Scripture in it and on which it is built. I grew up with a deep sense of "US" - the community, the family, the "togetherness" of the church. When I left Catholicism, I looked for the same - just with better theology. I found it in the LCMS.


My $0.01


- Josiah



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Being ground in something different seems to be the actual new trend, oddly enough. Well, much of the thing with Trump is against political correctness. In other words, people want to be offended. They want rules. They want standards.

Anyway, my own view is a lot of rules, traditions are highly useful and needed - but there's always the specter of abuse - as with anything. Well, on the cultural left, the abuse comes when people are loving and trusting - to the point of being naive.