Gift of Tongues

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Since I believe in Jesus do I not believe in his Father who sent him? I dont believe for a minute that Jesus came here to end the monotheistic faith of the God of Abraham.

Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw*it, and was glad.*57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?*58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.*59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Did Jesus ever say if you accept me you must accept the Trinity? No he said by accepting me you DO accept my father who sent me.

Is the Spirit of God a different Spirit than the Holy Spirit? Is God not a living God? Are not Jesus and the Father one?
The word trinity is not found in the Bible.

The English word "Trinity" comes from*Latin"Trinitas", meaning "the number*three".*This abstract noun is formed from the adjective*trinus*(three each, threefold, triple),*as the word*unitas*is the abstract noun formed from*unus*(one).

The corresponding word in*Greek*is "Τριάς" (Trias), meaning "a set of three" or "the number three."

The first recorded use of this Greek word in Christian theology was by*Theophilus of Antioch*in about 170. He did not speak about the Trinity of god.

In the creed it says that the trinity is unity and the unity is trinity. Yet when I say that I get slammed!
Without this creed no one here would be discussing trinity so heavily or even at all, it was not a subject for the apostles, they knew that accepting Christ WAS accepting the father.
I have no problem praying the Catholic "In the name (singular) of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" why would I? I believe in all three already as the same in essence but not of three SEPARATE eternities, its the same Spirit of God.

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Albion · Oct 8, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Since I believe in Jesus do I not believe in his Father who sent him?

According to what you wrote a few posts ago, you believe that Jesus Christ (the Son) IS the Father. Most of what I presented to you from Scripture refutes that view.

Did Jesus ever say if you accept me you must accept the Trinity?

As you know, the word (Trinity) does not appear in Scripture. It is shorthand for what does appear there, and that is clear in saying that the two are not identical or that one is really the other one but wearing a different guise, etc.

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

http://www.auburn.edu/~allenkc/trinity.html

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Albion said:
According to what you wrote a few posts ago, you believe that Jesus Christ (the Son) IS the Father. Most of what I presented to you from Scripture refutes that view.

As you know, the word (Trinity) does not appear in Scripture. It is shorthand for what does appear there, and that is clear in saying that the two are not identical or that one is really the other one but wearing a different guise, etc.

Yes Jesus is the Son of God he is not the Son of himself but of God, the God we call God, the God we worship. Jesus was teaching us all how to become sons of God.

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
John 1:12

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Lamb · Oct 8, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Yes Jesus is the Son of God he is not the Son of himself but of God, the God we call God, the God we worship. Jesus was teaching us all how to become sons of God.

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
John 1:12

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Do you believe Jesus is God?

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Lämmchen said:
Do you believe Jesus is God?

Yes.

Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Colossians 2:8-9

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Lamb · Oct 8, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Yes.

Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.
Colossians 2:8-9

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Do you believe the Holy Spirit is God?

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Lämmchen said:
Do you believe the Holy Spirit is God?

Jesus spoke for God and by his will, in that since yes he is the manifestation of God in the flesh, he is the way, light to the world, the word in the flesh, that was with God and was God since the beginning.
These are the "us" that made man in the image of God, when God breathed into Adam that breath was the Holy Spirit or Ruach.
These are attributes of God, his movement and his example through his image

He is the image of the invisible God, the first-born of all creation; for in him all things were created, in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible .... all things were created through him and for him."*(Colossians 1:15-16)

During the days when Christ's apostles lived, the Gospel was taught with accuracy, but after their death, it did not take very long for the truth to become eroded with falsehoods.

This erosion of Biblical truth grew like a cancer -- slow, but sure. Little by little, inacuracy crept in as the Gospel message of Jesus Christ became more and more popular.

In an effort to increase the church membership, many Pagans were brought in and with the Pagans came Pagan ideas. Rituals began to replace serious Bible study and differences in opinion soon became the basis for growth of various creeds and sects. Ober the span of many years, man-made rites became time honored tradition.

Christian leaders then became powerful forces in the church as well as in politics; religious beliefs, many times, were dictated by the state. These facts, however, are not surpirsing considering the Biblical warning:

"First of all you must understand this, that no prophecy ever came by the impulse of man, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

"But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them.... And many will follow their licentiousness, and because of them the way of truth will be reviled. And in their greed they will exploit you with false words...."*(2 Peter 1:20-21; 2:1-3)

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Imalive · Oct 8, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Since I believe in Jesus do I not believe in his Father who sent him? I dont believe for a minute that Jesus came here to end the monotheistic faith of the God of Abraham.

Your father Abraham rejoiced to see my day: and he saw*it, and was glad.*57Then said the Jews unto him, Thou art not yet fifty years old, and hast thou seen Abraham?*58Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.*59Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.

Did Jesus ever say if you accept me you must accept the Trinity? No he said by accepting me you DO accept my father who sent me.

Is the Spirit of God a different Spirit than the Holy Spirit? Is God not a living God? Are not Jesus and the Father one?
The word trinity is not found in the Bible.

The English word "Trinity" comes from*Latin"Trinitas", meaning "the number*three".*This abstract noun is formed from the adjective*trinus*(three each, threefold, triple),*as the word*unitas*is the abstract noun formed from*unus*(one).

The corresponding word in*Greek*is "Τριάς" (Trias), meaning "a set of three" or "the number three."

The first recorded use of this Greek word in Christian theology was by*Theophilus of Antioch*in about 170. He did not speak about the Trinity of god.

In the creed it says that the trinity is unity and the unity is trinity. Yet when I say that I get slammed!
Without this creed no one here would be discussing trinity so heavily or even at all, it was not a subject for the apostles, they knew that accepting Christ WAS accepting the father.
I have no problem praying the Catholic "In the name (singular) of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit" why would I? I believe in all three already as the same in essence but not of three SEPARATE eternities, its the same Spirit of God.

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

They are not seperate. Jesus is in the Father. The Father is in Him. When He sends the Holy Spirit They all come live in you, not just the Holy Spirit. That's where some trinitarians go wrong. They say Jesus and the Father are in heaven and the Spirit is on earth. Jesus told the disciples He would come live in them and the Father too when He would send the other Comforter.
One guy on christian forums got a dream of 2 white people, the Father and the Son. Come on that is impossible. You can't see the Father. All Stephen saw was His glory and Jesus at His right hand. If you want to see the Father you see Jesus. He made it easy to grasp. Look at Jesus and you see the Trinity, Father, Son and Spirit, 3 Persons in one Body and looking and acting very much like one Person.

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Im not trying to pounce on anyones denomination more than each of you already do to each other and of mine.
I really do however think its time we regroup as one instead of many.
If the Catholic church threw out all of its statues and rituals you would just have a building, much like our church where we have "Jesus" above the bath. Our bodies are the temple and if rejoicing in the good news of God and reading his word is cultish because we dont agree with all protestants or Catholicism than so be it, im willing to be beheaded for my Lord.

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Imalive · Oct 8, 2017

Albion said:
According to what you wrote a few posts ago, you believe that Jesus Christ (the Son) IS the Father. Most of what I presented to you from Scripture refutes that view.

As you know, the word (Trinity) does not appear in Scripture. It is shorthand for what does appear there, and that is clear in saying that the two are not identical or that one is really the other one but wearing a different guise, etc.

The Son is not the Father, but why is He called eternal Father in Isaiah 9:6?

For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Imalive said:
The Son is not the Father, but why is He called eternal Father in Isaiah 9:6?

For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

Exactly, Jesus is his image and the Spirit is his movements

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Albion · Oct 8, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Im not trying to pounce on anyones denomination more than each of you already do to each other and of mine.
I really do however think its time we regroup as one instead of many.
If the Catholic church threw out all of its statues and rituals you would just have a building, much like our church where we have "Jesus" above the bath.

Ah, but we and the Catholics don't have any baths in church, so the unity movement is foiled again! LOL

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Albion said:
Ah, but we and the Catholics don't have any baths in church, so the unity movement is foiled again! LOL

The Catholic church in my hometown had a bath... I think... and a cup for babies.
They also had statues that used to frighten the heck out of me when I was a child lol

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Albion · Oct 8, 2017

Imalive said:
The Son is not the Father, but why is He called eternal Father in Isaiah 9:6?

For unto us a Child is born,
Unto us a Son is given;
And the government will be upon His shoulder.
And His name will be called
Wonderful, Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.

That is an Old Testament book, as you know, and so it comes before the triune God had meaning to the Hebrews. The sense of the word in Isaiah is explained in the Wikipedia article, part of which follows:

"To God, according to Judaism, is attributed the fatherly role of protector. He is titled the Father of the poor, of the orphan and the widow, their guarantor of justice. He is also titled the Father of the king, as the teacher and helper over the judge of Israel. [32] According to Alon Goshen-Gottstein, in the Old Testament "Father" is generally a metaphor; it is not a proper name for God but rather one of many titles by which Jews speak of and to God."

The concept of the Father being the name of one of the three persona of the Trinity appears only with the coming of the Savior.

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Albion said:
That is an Old Testament book, as you know, and so it comes before the triune God had meaning to the Hebrews. The sense of the word in Isaiah is explained in the Wikipedia article, part of which follows:

"To God, according to Judaism, is attributed the fatherly role of protector. He is titled the Father of the poor, of the orphan and the widow, their guarantor of justice. He is also titled the Father of the king, as the teacher and helper over the judge of Israel. [32] According to Alon Goshen-Gottstein, in the Old Testament "Father" is generally a metaphor; it is not a proper name for God but rather one of many titles by which Jews speak of and to God."

The concept of the Father being the name of one of the three persona of the Trinity appears only with the coming of the Savior.

Before the understanding of a triune God?
God changes not.
Also no understanding of "Trinity" was ever an issue until after 300 years after the death of Christ which caused much bloodshed and persecution of those who didnt agree. In other words there was never any heresy charges against nonTrinitarian until after it was introduced in the 3rd century, I think its a little messed up.
Nothing good came out of calling God a trinity, the Church ordered it by law that if none follow they would be killed!

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Imalive · Oct 8, 2017

Albion said:
That is an Old Testament book, as you know, and so it comes before the triune God had meaning to the Hebrews. The sense of the word in Isaiah is explained in the Wikipedia article, part of which follows:

"To God, according to Judaism, is attributed the fatherly role of protector. He is titled the Father of the poor, of the orphan and the widow, their guarantor of justice. He is also titled the Father of the king, as the teacher and helper over the judge of Israel. [32] According to Alon Goshen-Gottstein, in the Old Testament "Father" is generally a metaphor; it is not a proper name for God but rather one of many titles by which Jews speak of and to God."

The concept of the Father being the name of one of the three persona of the Trinity appears only with the coming of the Savior.

https://www.google.nl/search?dcr=0&...5i39k1j0i67k1j0i131k1j0i203k1.216.AzldH-p3AJM

It's in the O.T. too. Israel was His firstborn son.
He calls Himself a Father in Maleachi, but it's harder to get the Trinity from the O.T. M. Brown shows Jews that's it's in the O.T. I see nowhere in the O.T. that they had to believe God is 3 Persons in order to be saved, not in the N.T. either, although His Spirit came over the prophets and Jesus appeared, God can't walk in a garden, that was Jesus. They couldn't see God and live, yet some saw Him and lived, that was Jesus.

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Church time gang!

Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Albion · Oct 8, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Before the understanding of a triune God?
God changes not.

No, but we were talking about how the Jews understood things.

Nothing good came out of calling God a trinity, the Church ordered it by law that if none follow they would be killed!

More of that garbage "history." This is one reason you were cautioned about the dangers of cults.

Anyway, I have tried to steer you right and not make too much of an issue of that speaking in tongues thing, but you are committed to Unitarianism even when the Bible has disproved it -- and you were the one who asked for the evidence.

More Coffee also earnestly and politely advised you to consider a more orthodox congregation, even if Pentecostal. But it will probably take you more time, just as it did many of us. So, Best Wishes on a successful spiritual journey to come.

Andrew · Oct 8, 2017

Albion said:
No, but we were talking about how the Jews understood things.

More of that garbage "history." This is one reason you were cautioned about the dangers of cults.

Anyway, I have tried to steer you right and not make too much of an issue of that speaking in tongues thing, but you are committed to Unitarianism even when the Bible has disproved it -- and you were the one who asked for the evidence.

More Coffee also earnestly and politely advised you to consider a more orthodox congregation, even if Pentecostal. But it will probably take you more time, just as it did many of us. So, Best Wishes on a successful spiritual journey to come.

Thanks brother. As far as garbage history goes lets just pray it doesnt repeat itself.
I dont need to leave my town congregation its saving lives left and right im fine just where I am at. Praising the lord and not manmade objects or ideas is my kind of church, we are not to blend in with the rest and so be it, im glad this church is different so go right ahead and call it a cult.
Pentecostals - "Bringing Catholics and Lutherans together since 1906"
I told you I did not want to debate the trinity that I was neither for it or against it but seeing the way trinitarians act like they have all the answers and know everything about the mysteries of God and what makes him up I lean more of what the original Apostolic Church said about the trinity - Nothing

Bartholomew Legate was burnt at the stake because he refused to adhere to the man made creed of Trinity. Moment of Fact brought to you by garbage "history"
Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

Gift of Tongues

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15

Matt 18:15

God's Lil Lamb

Matt 18:15

God's Lil Lamb

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15

Well-known member

Matt 18:15