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    World Religion & Speculative Theology - Thread: Do the ends justify the means?

    1. #21
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      Quote Originally Posted by Lämmchen View Post
      What "silly thing" (your words) are you accusing me of doing?
      My post replies to the topic and the suggestion that Rahab was sinning by doing what was needed to save the spies. It is silly to suggest that Rahab's lie to the men who wanted to kill the spies was a sin. It was instrumental in saving them. And Rahab is commended by God for saving them. There's no 'accusation' in stating the case for Rahab's innocence in the matter nor is there any is observing the accusing Rahab of sinning by telling a lie to save the spies is silly.

      Consider this passage, it too deals with telling lies:
      19 Micaiah replied, “Listen again to this word of the LORD. I saw Yahweh sitting on his throne with the entire host of heaven standing beside him on his right and on his left. 20 Then the LORD asked: ‘Who will entice Ahab that he may go and fall at Ramoth-gilead?’ One said one thing and another, another thing. 21 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, saying: ‘I will deceive him.’ 22 The LORD then asked him, ‘What will you do?’ To this, he replied: ‘I will go and make myself a lying spirit on the lips of all his prophets.’ Then the LORD said, ‘You shall succeed. Go, and do just that.’ 23 You must know that the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours because he willed to bring evil on you.
      (1KIngs 22:19-23)
      Last edited by MoreCoffee; 07-08-2018 at 03:18 PM.
      Pope Gregory I was well known for his alms to the poor, and he gave quite generously of the riches donated to the Church by the wealthy people of Rome. Everything from money to land was given to the poor in some fashion. He made clear to his subordinates that their duty was to relieve the distress faced by the poor.

      He ordered his clergy to go out into the streets to find and care for the poor in person.

    2. #22
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      Quote Originally Posted by MoreCoffee View Post
      My post replies to the topic and the suggestion that Rahab was sinning by doing what was needed to save the spies. It is silly to suggest that Rahab's lie to the men who wanted to kill the spies was a sin. It was instrumental in saving them. And Rahab is commended by God for saving them. There's no 'accusation' in stating the case for Rahab's innocence in the matter nor is there any is observing the accusing Rahab of sinning by telling a lie to save the spies is silly.

      Consider this passage, it too deals with telling lies:
      19 Micaiah replied, “Listen again to this word of the LORD. I saw Yahweh sitting on his throne with the entire host of heaven standing beside him on his right and on his left. 20 Then the LORD asked: ‘Who will entice Ahab that he may go and fall at Ramoth-gilead?’ One said one thing and another, another thing. 21 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, saying: ‘I will deceive him.’ 22 The LORD then asked him, ‘What will you do?’ To this, he replied: ‘I will go and make myself a lying spirit on the lips of all his prophets.’ Then the LORD said, ‘You shall succeed. Go, and do just that.’ 23 You must know that the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours because he willed to bring evil on you.
      (1KIngs 22:19-23)
      So you believe that bearing false witness was not a sin?
      "Christianity does not require more work but more trust." Pr. Jonathan Fisk
      "Bearing fruit does not make you a branch. A branch is a branch because it grows from the vine." Pr. Jonathan Fisk
      "A Christian's life is not defined by what the Christian does. It is defined by Christ and what He has done for us." Pr. Rolf David Preus

    3. #23
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      Quote Originally Posted by Lämmchen View Post
      So you believe that bearing false witness was not a sin?
      I believe what God said about Rahab's action; namely, that is is good. The question is about Rahab's action and not about some theological principle. God commends Rahab for her action and her action included telling the murderous men a lie. Let's not try to make the story of Rabah and the spies into an occasion for creating bad theology about Rahab and telling lies. And remember that story I mentioned? this one: 19 Micaiah replied, “Listen again to this word of the LORD. I saw Yahweh sitting on his throne with the entire host of heaven standing beside him on his right and on his left. 20 Then the LORD asked: ‘Who will entice Ahab that he may go and fall at Ramoth-gilead?’ One said one thing and another, another thing. 21 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the LORD, saying: ‘I will deceive him.’ 22 The LORD then asked him, ‘What will you do?’ To this, he replied: ‘I will go and make myself a lying spirit on the lips of all his prophets.’ Then the LORD said, ‘You shall succeed. Go, and do just that.’ 23 You must know that the LORD has put a lying spirit in the mouths of all these prophets of yours because he willed to bring evil on you.”
      (1KIngs 22:19-23)
      Pope Gregory I was well known for his alms to the poor, and he gave quite generously of the riches donated to the Church by the wealthy people of Rome. Everything from money to land was given to the poor in some fashion. He made clear to his subordinates that their duty was to relieve the distress faced by the poor.

      He ordered his clergy to go out into the streets to find and care for the poor in person.

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