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    Results 31 to 40 of 57

    World Religion & Speculative Theology - Thread: Grace

    1. #31
      MoreCoffee's Avatar
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      Angels are creatures so they very likely were created in time. Though it is possible that they are creatures of eternity. The Silmarillion suggests that they are creatures of eternity but that is a work of fiction.
      Saint Jude, author of the new testament letter.

      He is the patron of impossible causes because the scriptural Letter of St. Jude, which he authored, urges Christians to persevere in difficult times.

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    2. #32
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      Quote Originally Posted by Albion View Post
      I think it does. Apparently most Christians agree, although there are those who do not.
      The 6 days of creation are the bringing into existence creation itself which contains time...

      In them time is being created...

      How can they possibly be subject to time??

      Arsenios

    3. #33
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      Grace: God giving us what we don't deserve.
      Mercy: God not giving us what we do deserve.

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    5. #34
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      Grace: Unmerited favor

    6. #35
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      Quote Originally Posted by MoreCoffee View Post
      Angels are creatures so they very likely were created in time. Though it is possible that they are creatures of eternity. The Silmarillion suggests that they are creatures of eternity but that is a work of fiction.
      I think creation was created THROUGH the Angelic Powers and Principalities...

      Not my strong suit, I confess...

      Arsenios

    7. #36
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      Angels are eternal creatures otherwise how can some be locked away or demons exist as they are fallen angels as well. Also the lake of fire is eternal is it not?
      Isaiah 40:31

    8. #37
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      Quote Originally Posted by psalms 91 View Post
      Angels are eternal creatures otherwise how can some be locked away or demons exist as they are fallen angels as well. Also the lake of fire is eternal is it not?
      If they are eternal then they exist outside of time. But that is not really something I can recall being taught in Church nor in holy scripture. But I may be wrong, it is not a topic I have researched recently.
      Saint Jude, author of the new testament letter.

      He is the patron of impossible causes because the scriptural Letter of St. Jude, which he authored, urges Christians to persevere in difficult times.

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    9. #38
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      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      Grace: God giving us what we don't deserve.
      Mercy: God not giving us what we do deserve.
      Mhmmm. Nuff said.
      If you want to rile people up then go to a Christian site and give God ALL the glory for your salvation.

    10. #39
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      Quote Originally Posted by TurtleHare View Post
      Mhmmm. Nuff said.
      I didn't start this thread to find a pithy one line definition of grace and mercy. The first post says
      In the thread Salvation some questions were raised about "grace"

      One is about uncreated and created grace.

      Other questions were also raised.

      So, here is a new thread to discuss those specific issues. They do relate to Salvation but they also are a subject in themselves.
      Saint Jude, author of the new testament letter.

      He is the patron of impossible causes because the scriptural Letter of St. Jude, which he authored, urges Christians to persevere in difficult times.

      Hidden Content

    11. #40
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      Quote Originally Posted by MoreCoffee View Post
      The first post says
      In the thread Salvation some questions were raised about "grace"

      One is about uncreated and created grace.

      Other questions were also raised.

      So, here is a new thread to discuss those specific issues. They do relate to Salvation but they also are a subject in themselves.
      The doctrine of Theosis is Orthodox - It is not a part of any other Confession... It is our Treasury...

      It is about the Deification of the Holy Ones of God, the Saints...

      It means the possession by Grace of that which Christ possessed by Nature...

      It is not given to many...

      It is the Gift of Himself by God to Man in the Marriage of the Lamb in this life to those who are mature in Christ, to those perfected in Christ...

      Having said that, it is also the Perfection of the Faith of the Old Testament Saints, for the Gift of this Salvation is of God, and is not an exclusive Gift of the Incarnation of God...

      Indeed, it can be argued that the reason for the Incarnation of Christ was to Give us Rebirth BY God in Baptism so that unlike those under the Law of Moses, man can attain God by obedience to Christ... Theosis is the hidden feature of the Councils guiding their rulings and decisions which protect this UNION with God, this KNOWING God that John's Gospel defines as Life Eternal...

      It is not an intellectual event, this knowing God, but is an ontological one given BY God as He decides to Give it... It is the product of an encounter by God with man - The archetype is Moses, who having encountered God, had a face so lit up and shining that he had to cover it so that the Israelites could look at him... For him it became a permanent fisture of his visage... For others, not so much normally, and varying according to personal preparation by repentance...

      The two categories relevant are the Uncreated God and His Creation...

      Uncreated Grace is God Himself as God...

      Created grace is a good gift from creation given by God...

      God's Providence is created grace given by God...

      God's Salvation is Un-created Grace, is God's Giving of Himself...

      From your articles, it appears that the RCC does not possess this doctrine...

      Yet St. Thomas Aquinas summarized it about a year before his repose, when he had such an encounter, and recused himself from teaching and writing, telling his Abbot of the entirety of his great works and everything he had ever written, and we can infer even thought, that all of it is but STRAW - eg Fit for Burning...

      He had met God qua God, and never taught or wrote again of matters theological...

      I heard his story of this as a sophmore in college in philosophy class as an Ayn Rand atheist, and it brought me up short - I recognized a witness even as an atheist of an encounter with God, but such was to elude me another 12 years, nor did I ever dream it even might occur... Nor did I seek it... But I recognized it... As an atheist...

      Arsenios
      Last edited by Arsenios; 07-29-2018 at 06:28 PM.

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