Why are some Christians so consumed with their denomination?

MennoSota

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The answer to those questions lies in the fact that those in the denominations believe that the belief system of that particular denomination is the most biblically correct one. To stray outside of it would mean going into unbiblical territory and why risk that?

Alright, here is what you say is fact.
1) Those in the denominations believe that the belief system of that particular denomination is the most biblically correct one.
The question is: Why do they believe it? Do most do their research and come to that conclusion or do they follow without considering any possibility?
2) To stray outside of it would mean going into unbiblical territory and why risk that?
This may answer my second question to some degree. Rather than research and understanding what is biblically correct, people are scared to do so lest they die and go to hell. They would rather trust someone else's teaching than risk loss of eternal life.
I see that scare tactic used within many religions such as Islam, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witness, Hinduism, Scientology, etc. Is fear a valid reason to cling to a denomination?
 

Josiah

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Christ died for his elect and God calls them His children. Why, then, do people identify so strongly with their denomination when there is no biblical support for denominations?


In all my years in my parish, my denomination has not been mentioned ONCE during the Sunday morning worship service.


I DO think some are SO near-sighted that they parrot the denominational spins and claims without even realizing it. For example, on baptism, you have INSISTED that we just ignore whatever any denomination says and go ONLY by the black-and-white words we all can see on the pages of Scripture. And yet the ONLY thing you've done is chant (perfectly), parrot (verbatim) the unique, new, distinctive spin of the Anabaptist denominations on this and have never even attempted to quote the words of the Bible stating all the prohibitions, limitations, restrictions and prerequisites that are the Anabaptist Dogma on Baptist. You've been incredibly obsessed with your denomination, echoing verbatim its unique new spin - without ever crediting the denomination with it. Happens. Rarely as radically as you have done it, but it happens.





MennoSota said:
Yet we have two threads about why switch from X denomination to Y denomination.


Yes, a Catholic uploaded the first. A very sweeping impersonal one. Rather than deal with that, I choose to do a separate one, and to make it personal (just about me). A staffer drew me back to the Catholics but I've tried to keep my views in my thread. My thread is just do so as the Catholic did but make it personal, MY journey. MennoSota, you may be unaware but it has become quite common for people to switch denominations. And you may be unaware, but people often have their faith journeys that have impacted the church they participate with. If you can't relate to any of this, my counsel could be to simply not read or participate in those threads


Yet AGAIN, I disagree with your rubric that whatever is not ilustrated in the Bible is disallowed (which is why I think it's okay to post on the internet). You are correct, denominations aren't mentioned in the NT. Nor is the internet. Or baptism tanks behind a curtain. Or youth pastors and youth groups. Or colleges and seminaries. Or celebrating communion 4 times a year by passing around to everyone a bowl containing little cut up pieces of Weber's White Bread and little plastic cups of Welchs' grape juice. Or forbidding baptism to any under the never disclosed age of X. Or Gentiles baptizing anyone. Or using the internet. Friend, a lot of people simply reject your whole premise you've been demanding all over this site, this whole weird idea that if we don't see it illustrated in the Bible, it's forbidden and bad (and you keep shouting that by posting on the internet).



A blessed Lenten season to all.....



- Josiah





.
 
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tango

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Alright, here is what you say is fact.
1) Those in the denominations believe that the belief system of that particular denomination is the most biblically correct one.
The question is: Why do they believe it? Do most do their research and come to that conclusion or do they follow without considering any possibility?

This is the kind of question it's pointless to even try to answer because you can't group everybody together under one umbrella. Chances are within any denomination you'll have some who were born and raised in it and never questioned it, others who researched it and concluded it most accurately represented what Scripture requires, and still others who attend because they like the church and consider its ways to be an acceptable representation of Scripture.

I'm not even going to attempt to speak for "most people" within any denomination.

2) To stray outside of it would mean going into unbiblical territory and why risk that?
This may answer my second question to some degree. Rather than research and understanding what is biblically correct, people are scared to do so lest they die and go to hell. They would rather trust someone else's teaching than risk loss of eternal life.

This still assumes that people are simply listening to something said from the pulpit and turning off their own minds. Chances are within any denomination you will have some who are doing that, while you'll have others who stay within their denomination because they believe in what the denomination teaches having done research of their own.

I see that scare tactic used within many religions such as Islam, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witness, Hinduism, Scientology, etc. Is fear a valid reason to cling to a denomination?

Not at all, but it's not the only reason people stay within their denomination.

To go back to your opening statement, you say "Christ died for the elect" whereas I would say "Christ died for all". Without getting into the relative merits of the two positions, one of us is wrong. Either Christ died to extend an open invitation to heaven, or Christ died for a select group (for now we can exclude alternative worldviews relating to Christ not dying in the first place that would render us both wrong). If you were looking at a denomination that claimed Christ died for all, you would say they were wrong on that matter. If I were looking at a denomination that claimed Christ died for a select group, I would say they were wrong on that matter. Would you regard this as "clinging to our denominations", or as declining to join a denomination that we believed were wrong?
 

MennoSota

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This is the kind of question it's pointless to even try to answer because you can't group everybody together under one umbrella. Chances are within any denomination you'll have some who were born and raised in it and never questioned it, others who researched it and concluded it most accurately represented what Scripture requires, and still others who attend because they like the church and consider its ways to be an acceptable representation of Scripture.

I'm not even going to attempt to speak for "most people" within any denomination.



This still assumes that people are simply listening to something said from the pulpit and turning off their own minds. Chances are within any denomination you will have some who are doing that, while you'll have others who stay within their denomination because they believe in what the denomination teaches having done research of their own.



Not at all, but it's not the only reason people stay within their denomination.

To go back to your opening statement, you say "Christ died for the elect" whereas I would say "Christ died for all". Without getting into the relative merits of the two positions, one of us is wrong. Either Christ died to extend an open invitation to heaven, or Christ died for a select group (for now we can exclude alternative worldviews relating to Christ not dying in the first place that would render us both wrong). If you were looking at a denomination that claimed Christ died for all, you would say they were wrong on that matter. If I were looking at a denomination that claimed Christ died for a select group, I would say they were wrong on that matter. Would you regard this as "clinging to our denominations", or as declining to join a denomination that we believed were wrong?
Your last comments allow for us to explore scripture and compare. This seems to be frowned on by denominationalism. Instead, fear seems to be the tactic used to keep and draw people into the denomination.
 

Josiah

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I think people who evade denominations simply make themselves their own denomination: self.

I have to wonder.... with thousands of denominations available... why one would have views SO extremely unique and new that NO denomination shares them.
 

tango

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Your last comments allow for us to explore scripture and compare. This seems to be frowned on by denominationalism. Instead, fear seems to be the tactic used to keep and draw people into the denomination.

Perhaps your experience is different to mine - in my adult life I don't think I've encountered a church that frowns upon asking questions. I've been to one church that refused to provide answers to questions - a hyper-charismatic church that responded to me asking how their practises aligned with Scripture on the basis that either they were badly wrong or I was so badly misguided I was calling good evil and calling evil good with..... nothing. They asked for more details of my concerns and then just never bothered to reply. At all.
 

tango

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I think people who evade denominations simply make themselves their own denomination: self.

I have to wonder.... with thousands of denominations available... why one would have views SO extremely unique and new that NO denomination shares them.

My guess is that either people find themselves in an area that only has a few churches and none of them precisely reflect their views, or people find it's easier to discuss issues than choose a pigeonhole and end up exploring the differences in minutiae between similar denominations.

Personally when discussing issues with people I'd rather explore specific issues and beliefs - too often people write off those with differing viewpoints with little more than "ah, you're one of those (group) types" as if that were a reasoned counter to a viewpoint. It happens all over the place, as if "ah, I see you're a Lutheran" is all it takes to prove you are wrong when you express a Lutheran stance that differs from my stance.
 

MennoSota

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Perhaps your experience is different to mine - in my adult life I don't think I've encountered a church that frowns upon asking questions. I've been to one church that refused to provide answers to questions - a hyper-charismatic church that responded to me asking how their practises aligned with Scripture on the basis that either they were badly wrong or I was so badly misguided I was calling good evil and calling evil good with..... nothing. They asked for more details of my concerns and then just never bothered to reply. At all.
Your response is merely anecdotal, which makes it extremely limited.
 

Lamb

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Alright, here is what you say is fact.
1) Those in the denominations believe that the belief system of that particular denomination is the most biblically correct one.
The question is: Why do they believe it? Do most do their research and come to that conclusion or do they follow without considering any possibility?
2) To stray outside of it would mean going into unbiblical territory and why risk that?
This may answer my second question to some degree. Rather than research and understanding what is biblically correct, people are scared to do so lest they die and go to hell. They would rather trust someone else's teaching than risk loss of eternal life.
I see that scare tactic used within many religions such as Islam, Mormonism, Jehovah's Witness, Hinduism, Scientology, etc. Is fear a valid reason to cling to a denomination?

1) I can't speak for all people but I can tell you my own experience. I HAVE researched other denominations and other religions and almost left Lutheranism for a while but God pulled me right back after reading the bible from cover to cover in a relatively short amount of time. I know pastors who know Hebrew and Greek very well and have asked many questions, receiving answers that connect the entirety of scripture...always pointing to the Savior and the forgiveness of sins.

2) I've never been in a Lutheran church where any scare tactic was given and I'm sorry you've had to deal with that in your congregations.
 

Albion

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I think people who evade denominations simply make themselves their own denomination: self.

I have to wonder.... with thousands of denominations available... why one would have views SO extremely unique and new that NO denomination shares them.
I agree. They call themselves non-denominational when they are actually a one-person denomination.

And that is usually by choice. The claim that there aren't very many churches in the area--or that there is not the preferred one--does not explain why such a person refuses ever to attend any of them but decline membership.
 

MennoSota

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1) I can't speak for all people but I can tell you my own experience. I HAVE researched other denominations and other religions and almost left Lutheranism for a while but God pulled me right back after reading the bible from cover to cover in a relatively short amount of time. I know pastors who know Hebrew and Greek very well and have asked many questions, receiving answers that connect the entirety of scripture...always pointing to the Savior and the forgiveness of sins.

2) I've never been in a Lutheran church where any scare tactic was given and I'm sorry you've had to deal with that in your congregations.

I have not dealt with scare tactics in my life. If I did, I would walk away from that church. I can say that such isolated denominationalism exists. For example, I have met Wisconsin synod members who believe that only the Wisconsin synod members are saved. The rest are reprobate. I have met Roman church members who believe that only a Roman church member can be saved. The rest are perishing. I observe these scare tactics throughout history whenever the church has been directly tied to the State government.
Why do so many identify by denomination first and Christian faith second?
I see it here at the CH quite often. I read comments where the most important thing is to force someone into a denomination rather than argue a theological point.
 

Andrew

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I have not dealt with scare tactics in my life. If I did, I would walk away from that church. I can say that such isolated denominationalism exists. For example, I have met Wisconsin synod members who believe that only the Wisconsin synod members are saved. The rest are reprobate. I have met Roman church members who believe that only a Roman church member can be saved. The rest are perishing. I observe these scare tactics throughout history whenever the church has been directly tied to the State government.
Why do so many identify by denomination first and Christian faith second?
I see it here at the CH quite often. I read comments where the most important thing is to force someone into a denomination rather than argue a theological point.
It gets on my nerves when my church does that whole "only we" talk.

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tango

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Your response is merely anecdotal, which makes it extremely limited.

I'm not sure what else you want me to say. You're asking sweeping questions about groups that encompass all sorts of sub-groups, then complaining that a response is anecdotal. My experience is that people don't tend to do this. If you want other experience you'd need to talk to other people.
 

MennoSota

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I'm not sure what else you want me to say. You're asking sweeping questions about groups that encompass all sorts of sub-groups, then complaining that a response is anecdotal. My experience is that people don't tend to do this. If you want other experience you'd need to talk to other people.
Certainly. I am not wedded to your words only.
 

tango

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Certainly. I am not wedded to your words only.

Nor should you be, it just rather stifles discussion to ask questions and then write off people's experience as being merely anecdotal.

Honestly, if you were wedded to the words of a stranger on the internet you'd have much bigger problems than denominational issues.
 

MennoSota

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Nor should you be, it just rather stifles discussion to ask questions and then write off people's experience as being merely anecdotal.

Honestly, if you were wedded to the words of a stranger on the internet you'd have much bigger problems than denominational issues.
It stifles discussion when you run down a rabbit hole and speak of irrelevant issues. You may go now.
 

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It stifles discussion when you run down a rabbit hole and speak of irrelevant issues. You may go now.
So division among Christian's isn't too cool according to you and scripture; but what about the division of GOD'S creation? Man as a whole?

You made it clear you are against any sort of universal love by GOD for HIS creation; seemingly. We are told brother will fight brother and father, but are told our enemy is to be as our friend. What do you make of it?



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ImaginaryDay2

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The answer to those questions lies in the fact that those in the denominations believe that the belief system of that particular denomination is the most biblically correct one. To stray outside of it would mean going into unbiblical territory and why risk that?

But here's the issue - if that's the case, that those in the denominations believe it to be most "biblically correct", then that person is merely straying into subjecivism. There has to be some objective 'truth' that the decision is weighed against. Otherwise, it's exactly as the OP says, denominational attachment. ([MENTION=394]MennoSota[/MENTION] - mark this moment - I might be agreeing with you somewhat :D)
 

Albion

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But here's the issue - if that's the case, that those in the denominations believe it to be most "biblically correct", then that person is merely straying into subjecivism. There has to be some objective 'truth' that the decision is weighed against.
The individual uses his best judgment and whatever evidence he thinks convincing. That's what all of us do, no matter what decision we are facing--whether to buy that new house or car, which college to enroll in, whether the person you have been dating is the one to marry...just about everything. The point is simply that they are moved to seek the right denomination. If they make a mistake (and all of them obviously cannot be correct although every one has members who think their church is the best or most correct one), they still have chosen for that reason.
 

Andrew

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And there was also a strife among them, which of them should be accounted the greatest. And he said unto them, The kings of the Gentiles exercise lordship over them; and they that exercise authority upon them are called benefactors. But ye shall not be so: but he that is greatest among you, let him be as the younger; and he that is chief, as he that doth serve. For whether is greater, he that sitteth at meat, or he that serveth? is not he that sitteth at meat? but I am among you as he that serveth. Ye are they which have continued with me in my temptations. And I appoint unto you a kingdom, as my Father hath appointed unto me; That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Luke 22:24-30


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