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    Results 31 to 38 of 38

    Christian Theology - Thread: Why Does Evil Exist?

    1. #31
      atpollard is offline Prodigy Member
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      Your definition of Limited Atonement seems to differ greatly from what I was taught that phrase means by Calvinist sources.
      Ironically, I came to the other 4 points of TULIP from reading the bible for myself while attending the Church of God (non-Calvinist) before I had ever even heard of Calvinism or Arminianism. Limited Atonement was the last point of Calvinism that I came to accept, and the point about which I am most indifferent, because I never gave any thought early in my walk to whether Jesus took only the sins of the eternally saved with him to the cross (justifying God's eternal punishment for the sin of unbelievers) or if Jesus died for all sins (so God punishes the same sin twice). I was content in the knowledge that Jesus had died for MY sins and the rest seemed a matter best left to God to work out the balance of divine justice.

      You seem to throw out 'Limited Atonement' as a catch phrase for something completely different. Your definition of Free Will seems to have more to do with a denial of 'Total Depravity' since you seem to grant fallen man the power to choose or reject God when the bible often describes us as 'dead' before God's grace granted us faith and life and drew us to Christ.

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    3. #32
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      meluckycharms is offline Apprentice Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by atpollard View Post
      Your definition of Free Will seems to have more to do with a denial of 'Total Depravity' since you seem to grant fallen man the power to choose or reject God when the bible often describes us as 'dead' before God's grace granted us faith and life and drew us to Christ.
      Well, total depravity is a debatable topic in itself. The good news is that regardless of who is right or wrong, we will both have a chance to ask God ourselves.


      Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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    5. #33
      atpollard is offline Prodigy Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by meluckycharms View Post
      Well, total depravity is a debatable topic in itself. The good news is that regardless of who is right or wrong, we will both have a chance to ask God ourselves.


      Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
      Aw heck, people can debate the topic "a". I have spilled many an electron with JWs over "and the Word was (a) God".
      But Calvinism and Arminianism do not seem to fall into THAT category. It is one thing to deny who Jesus is, that is 'shake the dust off' territory and leave them to God to deal with. To have a difference of opinion on the details of how God does what only God does, is something completely different. I like the Moravian motto: "In essentials, Unity. In non-essentials, Liberty. In all things, Charity."

      I don't always walk it as well as I should. I tend to take attacks on Calvinism too personally. Especially if I feel Reformed Theology is being misrepresented as a bad characture of what it actually teaches.

      So when we get to heaven, I'll be able to tell you 'told you so.'
      Last edited by atpollard; 01-14-2018 at 11:09 AM.

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    7. #34
      Josiah's Avatar
      Josiah is offline Bronze Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
      I can't (or won't) theorize. It just does. IMO, the important question is not "how come?' but "what now?"

      Why does lead exist? I can tell you HOW it exists, but not why.....

      IMO, nothing suggested in this thread even addresses the issue of why.

      Yes, it seems unavoidable that God - IN SOME MYSTERIOUS SENSE - permits much. But that has nothing whatsoever to do with why it exists, and it certainly has nothing whatsoever to do with God willing or desiring it (either as primary or secondary will).

      IMO, the Bible teaches THAT it exists. And then focuses on our response to it (both God and man's). The issue the Bible is focused in what the issue of WHAT NOW than HOW COME?



      - Josiah

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    9. #35
      MennoSota is offline Expert Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
      Why does lead exist? I can tell you HOW it exists, but not why.....

      IMO, nothing suggested in this thread even addresses the issue of why.

      Yes, it seems unavoidable that God - IN SOME MYSTERIOUS SENSE - permits much. But that has nothing whatsoever to do with why it exists, and it certainly has nothing whatsoever to do with God willing or desiring it (either as primary or secondary will).

      IMO, the Bible teaches THAT it exists. And then focuses on our response to it (both God and man's). The issue the Bible is focused in what the issue of WHAT NOW than HOW COME?



      - Josiah
      Are you arguing with yourself now?

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    11. #36
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      Quote Originally Posted by Josiah View Post
      Why does lead exist? I can tell you HOW it exists, but not why.....

      IMO, nothing suggested in this thread even addresses the issue of why.

      Yes, it seems unavoidable that God - IN SOME MYSTERIOUS SENSE - permits much. But that has nothing whatsoever to do with why it exists, and it certainly has nothing whatsoever to do with God willing or desiring it (either as primary or secondary will).

      IMO, the Bible teaches THAT it exists. And then focuses on our response to it (both God and man's). The issue the Bible is focused in what the issue of WHAT NOW than HOW COME?



      - Josiah
      For the plumbers.

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    13. #37
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      Quote Originally Posted by atpollard View Post
      I don't always walk it as well as I should. I tend to take attacks on Calvinism too personally. Especially if I feel Reformed Theology is being misrepresented as a bad characture of what it actually teaches.

      So when we get to heaven, I'll be able to tell you 'told you so.'
      Or what my theology professor would say, "Tolerance is merely respecting another person's right to be wrong."

      Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk

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    15. #38
      atpollard is offline Prodigy Member
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      Quote Originally Posted by meluckycharms View Post
      Or what my theology professor would say, "Tolerance is merely respecting another person's right to be wrong."

      Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G930A using Tapatalk
      My mentor has a Masters from Moody and likes to say "I'm not their mother. My responsibility is to tell what I know. I am not responsible for making them believe it."

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