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    Bible Study - Thread: Taking Thoughts Captive

    1. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by ValleyGal View Post
      I think this is one of my favorite subjects. Renewing your mind and setting your mind on things above is a command - it's not something we passively sit back and let the Spirit do. We must be proactive in the process. Taking thoughts captive and making them obedient to Christ is part of that process. It requires a good deal of self-awareness, self-honesty, knowledge of biblical principles, and determination (being intentional). I believe that Cognitive-Behavioural therapy is based on taking thoughts captive.

      Here is an example that we give our clients. In scenario one, the core belief is "my partner does not like me". Everything the partner then does is translated using this belief. The partner makes dinner, so the thought "my partner does not like me" interprets it "s/he wants something from me" or "s/he is trying to poison me." In scenario two, the core belief is "my partner loves me". Everything is translated using this belief, so when the partner makes dinner, the translation is "s/he really cares and did something special for me" or "what a treat because s/he knows I've had a long day."

      In scenario two, the core belief is honoring to God because we are to love our spouse. But in scenario one, the core belief needs to be identified and then changed. Once it's identified and replaced with a more appropriate belief, you have to have a high level of self-awareness to realize exactly when you are having those negative core belief translations, so you can interrupt the process. Once you realize what you're thinking is not honoring to God, you can then do some self talk (taking it captive) and make it obedient by reminding yourself of the changed core belief. Eventually, the core belief itself will change.

      The process works with sin, too. If you are tempted, identify the temptation, remind yourself of thoughts or behaviours that are honoring to God, and align your own will with God's by reminding yourself how much you love him...you love him enough that his will means more to you than your own will - and this is going to align your will to his...you will hate the sin as much as God hates the sin.

      It all takes a lot of time and intentional focus on the messages you tell yourself, but it can be done! And the rewards are more than worth it!
      Anything negative needs to be quickened immediately its never good. I fall into forgetfulness about looking up, its a simple switch when you remember, for me its like a higher bliss as my mind shifts into love and peace, not worrying about the future just on the now. And God is there. Its easy to feel depressed and forget to turn it back on but when you do your whole world changes and you have peace again, i believe this is the state we should be at all the time.

      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

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    3. #12
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      Continued from #7+#8 ...
      Hi again. For Petes sake, eh? Lol.

      (Dont worry, I wasnt saying you were negating your beliefs, just pointing out my general observations when ppl use the word 'but' sometimes.)

      I cant stress it enough, its important for all of us to remember not to take a verse, or an idea about a verse, and make a doctrine out of it...
      ESPECIALLY if it causes doubt, fear, or confusion about the saving grace of God.

      The enemies favorite point of attack is right in our mind, our thoughts, and he often uses scripture (out of context, or misquoted) to do it.
      Dont fall for it.

      I'm guessing you were referring to 1Tim4:1 when you mentioned ppl turning from the faith.
      Continue reading on...it says they give heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils.
      They speak lies in hypocrisy, and verse 3 gives example of those doctrines...Forbidding to marry and commanding to abstain from meats/or certain foods. (Sound familiar?)

      This is not a reference to 'a believer losing your salvation' ... These are unbelievers, not ppl that Jesus saved but then lost.

      Paul is informing Timothy what is to come.
      V.6 encourages Tim to remind the 'brethren' of these things, so they wouldnt be shaken that these might be believers doing this.

      When you see ppl departing from the faith and sound doctrine, you continue on in it. They are not brethren, they are rejectors of Jesus and the grace of God.
      Some may even have had a 'profession' of faith, but weren't really believers. Paul wanted Timothy, as a young minister (and us by extension) not to lose heart when he'd see these things happening, just keep giving the gospel, perhaps even some might return (v.16).

      (Okay, To be continued, re: your mention of feelings)
      Also, your mention of 'inviting demons in 7fold' ??
      Yeesh! Oy! Thats just not...oy, um, err, ok, I'll have to get to that later, lol.
      (I THINK I know what you're referrencing there, but ... wow!) Maybe tomorrow for that one .....
      God bless.
      ~Deliberate ignorance
      is anti-christian~

    4. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by Snerfle View Post
      Continued from #7+#8 ...
      Hi again. For Petes sake, eh? Lol.

      (Dont worry, I wasnt saying you were negating your beliefs, just pointing out my general observations when ppl use the word 'but' sometimes.)

      I cant stress it enough, its important for all of us to remember not to take a verse, or an idea about a verse, and make a doctrine out of it...
      ESPECIALLY if it causes doubt, fear, or confusion about the saving grace of God.

      The enemies favorite point of attack is right in our mind, our thoughts, and he often uses scripture (out of context, or misquoted) to do it.
      Dont fall for it.

      I'm guessing you were referring to 1Tim4:1 when you mentioned ppl turning from the faith.
      Continue reading on...it says they give heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils.
      They speak lies in hypocrisy, and verse 3 gives example of those doctrines...Forbidding to marry and commanding to abstain from meats/or certain foods. (Sound familiar?)

      This is not a reference to 'a believer losing your salvation' ... These are unbelievers, not ppl that Jesus saved but then lost.

      Paul is informing Timothy what is to come.
      V.6 encourages Tim to remind the 'brethren' of these things, so they wouldnt be shaken that these might be believers doing this.

      When you see ppl departing from the faith and sound doctrine, you continue on in it. They are not brethren, they are rejectors of Jesus and the grace of God.
      Some may even have had a 'profession' of faith, but weren't really believers. Paul wanted Timothy, as a young minister (and us by extension) not to lose heart when he'd see these things happening, just keep giving the gospel, perhaps even some might return (v.16).

      (Okay, To be continued, re: your mention of feelings)
      Also, your mention of 'inviting demons in 7fold' ??
      Yeesh! Oy! Thats just not...oy, um, err, ok, I'll have to get to that later, lol.
      (I THINK I know what you're referrencing there, but ... wow!) Maybe tomorrow for that one .....
      God bless.
      When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.
      Matthew 12:43-45


      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

    5. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by DHoffmann View Post
      When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest, and findeth none. Then he saith, I will return into my house from whence I came out; and when he is come, he findeth it empty, swept, and garnished. Then goeth he, and taketh with himself seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter in and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first. Even so shall it be also unto this wicked generation.
      Matthew 12:43-45


      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk
      Yes Im WELL aware of the passage in Matthew.
      It was what you said in your post that left me going (hunh?) bc what you said gives an entirely diff meaning to the scripture you quoted.
      And Im pleading with you, as a friend and brother, Please, avoid the temptation of taking 1or 2 verses out of context and/or putting a twist on them. I just pointed out before, its what the enemy (and many 'popular religious' types) like to do.
      You want to avoid that (and them), except when needed to contend for the faith, not to be like them.

      The Matthew passage has nothing to do with someone 'experiencing the rebirth' (?), or inviting demons 7fold (?) into his house.

      Hang in there, brother, I'll get back to you.
      ~Deliberate ignorance
      is anti-christian~

    6. #15
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      Quote Originally Posted by Snerfle View Post
      Yes Im WELL aware of the passage in Matthew.
      It was what you said in your post that left me going (hunh?) bc what you said gives an entirely diff meaning to the scripture you quoted.
      And Im pleading with you, as a friend and brother, Please, avoid the temptation of taking 1or 2 verses out of context and/or putting a twist on them. I just pointed out before, its what the enemy (and many 'popular religious' types) like to do.
      You want to avoid that (and them), except when needed to contend for the faith, not to be like them.

      The Matthew passage has nothing to do with someone 'experiencing the rebirth' (?), or inviting demons 7fold (?) into his house.

      Hang in there, brother, I'll get back to you.
      I was referring to backsliders in general and we all get judged in the end, i'll find the scriptures about what I mean on losing salvation and hopefully I wont take it out of context, Judas lost his salvation right?
      About inviting demons, i'll study those chapters again and read some commentary but from what I gather, if you rid your 'house' of demons and make no room for Jesus in your life they will come back in to your 'clean' house and bring other demons... just a metaphor but people who for example relapse on drugs usually get worse to the point they are likely to overdose, again thats hardly the best I can come up with right now but im a bit busy too lol we'll continue

      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

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    8. #16
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      Don't doubt. God will finish what He started. And don't fall asleep. Abide in Him. That's all.
      This guy was spot on:

      But, why then does God command and invite sinners to believe, if they’re unable? Perhaps, He uses the commands/invitations to come to Christ, as the “means to the end.”

      In other words, perhaps He uses the command to repent, as the means to granting repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as the means to giving the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitation to come to Christ, as the means to give the desire and ability to come.

      The idea that God uses commands as a means to an end is also demonstrated in how He preserves us in salvation. For, He actually warns true Christians of eternal damnation in Jn. 15:2, 6; Rom. 11:20-22; 1 Cor. 9:25, 27; Rev. 22:19, etc. And at the same time, He promises us eternal security. How then can we reconcile these 2 “seemingly contradictory” truths? It’s simple…

      He uses the warnings of losing our salvation as the means to preserve us in His promised eternal salvation. His warnings of losing salvation are the means He uses to keep us persevering to the end

      Here’s a clear example where God used warning as the means to the end of fulfilling His promise.


      Promises of Divine Security:
      “there will be no loss of life among you…” (Acts 27:22)
      “God has granted you all those…with you.” (Acts 27:24)
      “not a hair will fall from the head of any…” (Acts 27:34)

      Warning of Human Responsibility:
      “Unless these men stay in the ship, you cannot be saved.” (Acts 27:31)

      Now, how in the world could God possibly warn of those sailors losing their lives, since He just promised that they wouldn’t lose their lives? It’s simple…God used the warning of death to keep them in the ship, to preserve them from death.

      Likewise, He uses the command to repent, as the means to grant repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as a means to give the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitations to come to Christ, as the means to draw sinners to Christ
      Last edited by Imalive; 12-05-2017 at 04:23 PM.

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    10. #17
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      Quote Originally Posted by Imalive View Post
      Don't doubt. God will finish what He started. And don't fall asleep. Abide in Him. That's all.
      This guy was spot on:

      But, why then does God command and invite sinners to believe, if they’re unable? Perhaps, He uses the commands/invitations to come to Christ, as the “means to the end.”

      In other words, perhaps He uses the command to repent, as the means to granting repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as the means to giving the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitation to come to Christ, as the means to give the desire and ability to come.

      The idea that God uses commands as a means to an end is also demonstrated in how He preserves us in salvation. For, He actually warns true Christians of eternal damnation in Jn. 15:2, 6; Rom. 11:20-22; 1 Cor. 9:25, 27; Rev. 22:19, etc. And at the same time, He promises us eternal security. How then can we reconcile these 2 “seemingly contradictory” truths? It’s simple…

      He uses the warnings of losing our salvation as the means to preserve us in His promised eternal salvation. His warnings of losing salvation are the means He uses to keep us persevering to the end

      Here’s a clear example where God used warning as the means to the end of fulfilling His promise.


      Promises of Divine Security:
      “there will be no loss of life among you…” (Acts 27:22)
      “God has granted you all those…with you.” (Acts 27:24)
      “not a hair will fall from the head of any…” (Acts 27:34)

      Warning of Human Responsibility:
      “Unless these men stay in the ship, you cannot be saved.” (Acts 27:31)

      Now, how in the world could God possibly warn of those sailors losing their lives, since He just promised that they wouldn’t lose their lives? It’s simple…God used the warning of death to keep them in the ship, to preserve them from death.

      Likewise, He uses the command to repent, as the means to grant repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as a means to give the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitations to come to Christ, as the means to draw sinners to Christ
      Good preaching sister thank you!

      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

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    12. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by Imalive View Post
      Don't doubt. God will finish what He started. And don't fall asleep. Abide in Him. That's all.
      This guy was spot on:

      But, why then does God command and invite sinners to believe, if they’re unable? Perhaps, He uses the commands/invitations to come to Christ, as the “means to the end.”

      In other words, perhaps He uses the command to repent, as the means to granting repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as the means to giving the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitation to come to Christ, as the means to give the desire and ability to come.

      The idea that God uses commands as a means to an end is also demonstrated in how He preserves us in salvation. For, He actually warns true Christians of eternal damnation in Jn. 15:2, 6; Rom. 11:20-22; 1 Cor. 9:25, 27; Rev. 22:19, etc. And at the same time, He promises us eternal security. How then can we reconcile these 2 “seemingly contradictory” truths? It’s simple…

      He uses the warnings of losing our salvation as the means to preserve us in His promised eternal salvation. His warnings of losing salvation are the means He uses to keep us persevering to the end

      Here’s a clear example where God used warning as the means to the end of fulfilling His promise.


      Promises of Divine Security:
      “there will be no loss of life among you…” (Acts 27:22)
      “God has granted you all those…with you.” (Acts 27:24)
      “not a hair will fall from the head of any…” (Acts 27:34)

      Warning of Human Responsibility:
      “Unless these men stay in the ship, you cannot be saved.” (Acts 27:31)

      Now, how in the world could God possibly warn of those sailors losing their lives, since He just promised that they wouldn’t lose their lives? It’s simple…God used the warning of death to keep them in the ship, to preserve them from death.

      Likewise, He uses the command to repent, as the means to grant repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as a means to give the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitations to come to Christ, as the means to draw sinners to Christ
      Quote Originally Posted by DHoffmann View Post
      Good preaching sister thank you!

      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk
      Oh man oh man oh man.
      My heart is breaking again and again.
      Honestly, I dont understand, unless this is just an attempt by someone I love and care about very much to hurt me.
      I'm getting more and more convinced that if I preached fear and look out, she'd be preaching osas better than Jesus ,John, Peter and Paul combined.

      Or if I suddenly became a RomanCatholic, she'd be signing up for the Berean Call. Lol.
      If I said Ive suddenly become a BillJohnson NAR devotee, she'd be singing the praises of John MacArthur. (Believe me, she's no fan, lol)

      And I wish I could chuckle more about this, but it's really not that exaggerated and not too funny, my heart is hurting.

      On a certain level, I know who and whats behind it, and thats pretty sad and frustrating, but oh well, I tried, and there's not much I can do. Ppl make their choices of the heart, I have no right to protest that, right? But there's something else going on on another level that I just dont quite understand, (but perhaps I do and just dont want to admit it?)

      Plus, there just seems to be a deliberate antagonism with an attempt to 'get to me' that has a really unchristian feel to it, imo, and feels pretty hateful and hurtful, and I just dont get the point of it. It's like the antithesis of Hebrews13:1, one of my favorite verses.

      Anyway, I wont elaborate here and now, Im just praying for understanding and an end to animosity and...well...Hebrews13:1. And if you would, Id really appreciate your prayers too.

      Meanwhile, I just gotta say, hold on there to the applause over the guys preaching.
      Id like to know who this is copied from, and who said this guy is 'spot on' bc, imo, this is just horrible scriptorture, I mean, I dont even know where to begin.
      Just please, DH, again, watch out for teaching that starts with a pretext and then takes verses out of context and pieces them together to try to prove the point.
      This is another time where I'll have to say I have to get back to you, as it takes me a long time on an unreliable device, and I hope to try to unscramble this.
      ~Deliberate ignorance
      is anti-christian~

    13. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by Snerfle View Post
      Oh man oh man oh man.
      My heart is breaking again and again.
      Honestly, I dont understand, unless this is just an attempt by someone I love and care about very much to hurt me.
      I'm getting more and more convinced that if I preached fear and look out, she'd be preaching osas better than Jesus ,John, Peter and Paul combined.

      Or if I suddenly became a RomanCatholic, she'd be signing up for the Berean Call. Lol.
      If I said Ive suddenly become a BillJohnson NAR devotee, she'd be singing the praises of John MacArthur. (Believe me, she's no fan, lol)

      And I wish I could chuckle more about this, but it's really not that exaggerated and not too funny, my heart is hurting.

      On a certain level, I know who and whats behind it, and thats pretty sad and frustrating, but oh well, I tried, and there's not much I can do. Ppl make their choices of the heart, I have no right to protest that, right? But there's something else going on on another level that I just dont quite understand, (but perhaps I do and just dont want to admit it?)

      Plus, there just seems to be a deliberate antagonism with an attempt to 'get to me' that has a really unchristian feel to it, imo, and feels pretty hateful and hurtful, and I just dont get the point of it. It's like the antithesis of Hebrews13:1, one of my favorite verses.

      Anyway, I wont elaborate here and now, Im just praying for understanding and an end to animosity and...well...Hebrews13:1. And if you would, Id really appreciate your prayers too.

      Meanwhile, I just gotta say, hold on there to the applause over the guys preaching.
      Id like to know who this is copied from, and who said this guy is 'spot on' bc, imo, this is just horrible scriptorture, I mean, I dont even know where to begin.
      Just please, DH, again, watch out for teaching that starts with a pretext and then takes verses out of context and pieces them together to try to prove the point.
      This is another time where I'll have to say I have to get back to you, as it takes me a long time on an unreliable device, and I hope to try to unscramble this.

      Her statement seemed to go along on your view... are you sure you read it right?

      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk

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    15. #20
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      Quote Originally Posted by Imalive View Post
      Don't doubt. God will finish what He started. And don't fall asleep. Abide in Him. That's all.
      This guy was spot on:

      But, why then does God command and invite sinners to believe, if they’re unable? Perhaps, He uses the commands/invitations to come to Christ, as the “means to the end.”

      In other words, perhaps He uses the command to repent, as the means to granting repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as the means to giving the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitation to come to Christ, as the means to give the desire and ability to come.

      The idea that God uses commands as a means to an end is also demonstrated in how He preserves us in salvation. For, He actually warns true Christians of eternal damnation in Jn. 15:2, 6; Rom. 11:20-22; 1 Cor. 9:25, 27; Rev. 22:19, etc. And at the same time, He promises us eternal security. How then can we reconcile these 2 “seemingly contradictory” truths? It’s simple…

      He uses the warnings of losing our salvation as the means to preserve us in His promised eternal salvation. His warnings of losing salvation are the means He uses to keep us persevering to the end

      Here’s a clear example where God used warning as the means to the end of fulfilling His promise.


      Promises of Divine Security:
      “there will be no loss of life among you…” (Acts 27:22)
      “God has granted you all those…with you.” (Acts 27:24)
      “not a hair will fall from the head of any…” (Acts 27:34)

      Warning of Human Responsibility:
      “Unless these men stay in the ship, you cannot be saved.” (Acts 27:31)

      Now, how in the world could God possibly warn of those sailors losing their lives, since He just promised that they wouldn’t lose their lives? It’s simple…God used the warning of death to keep them in the ship, to preserve them from death.

      Likewise, He uses the command to repent, as the means to grant repentance. And, He uses the command to believe, as a means to give the gift of faith. And, He uses the invitations to come to Christ, as the means to draw sinners to Christ
      Quote Originally Posted by DHoffmann View Post

      Her statement seemed to go along on your view... are you sure you read it right?

      Sent from my LGLS755 using Tapatalk
      Ahh, yes, good observation, and that I do apologize for, I honestly wanted to say that the first line (before the copy/paste) was good, and I failed to say that, but yes, dont doubt. Yes yes, God will finish what He started. THATS ETERNAL SECURITY...THATS O S A S!
      I'm not sure what the 'dont sleep' reference is, and Abide in Christ of course I agree, but thats another one of those verses thats often misunderstood and mis-taught ... I wont get into it here.
      But yes, if Ima made those first comments, of course I agree with her, for sure!
      But the guy who did the scripture commentary was not 'spot on' imo. Not at all.
      But yes, Ima's first comments WERE spot on, and I thank you for pointing that out and poking me.
      ~Deliberate ignorance
      is anti-christian~

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