Doubts in my Church

Albion · Nov 29, 2017

Hi, Mtzopera.

FWIW, most of us have made the same suggestion.

Andrew · Nov 29, 2017

mtzopera said:
DHoffman-It sounds like you are in a "Oneness Pentecostal Church", which in most Christian circles teaches "modalism," the doctrine that the persons of the Trinity represent only three modes or aspects of the divine revelation, not distinct and coexisting persons in the divine nature. You should do some deeper research on this heretical doctrine. It sounds like the Holy Spirit is directing you elsewhere.

I am Trinitarian now which is why my views towards this church are changing. They often say "we dont believe in three gods" but neither do Catholics, no matter how I argued my oneness belief here it was just a waste of time as everyone here worships one God anyway, t just took me a while to comprehend what "triune" meant and what "Godhead" meant

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tango · Nov 29, 2017

DHoffmann said:
Right on, we can stomp on snakes all day but they dont lead the way, God left a trail of them lol
The presence feeling I had is usually at home praying when I was very broken, I felt it when praying in church, outside church I feel it more like stern father ready to smite me if I yelp a curse word or something lol nothing dark or creepy but out of respect and fear and feel his presence in certain situations especially when I get upset, I then hear in my conscience as him speaking the most kind reassuring words and encouragement that brings me back to him. The first visit to the church I remember coming home and I wept and cried and sobbed over his love the whole night, i felt his forgiveness and mercy I almost couldn't accept it but I trusted him and thanked him. Thats when things really started looking up in my life. I understand what you mean by reality hits in on monday and such and such, thats true but its not the same as what I was describing, those feelings you are mentioning is more like a runners high

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The stern father ready to smite you if you step even slightly out of line doesn't sound very much like the loving God of the Bible, does it? Touching on what you said earlier about holy living I wonder if that's something that has taken a good concept and turned it into something unhealthy. Yes, we should be holy, we should strive to live a holy life, but the idea that God is sitting watching us ready to smite us if we do the smallest thing wrong doesn't seem very helpful to me. It paints the picture that some seem to truly carry around of God as some kind of cosmic sadist watching us walk a tightrope over the fiery furnace, wondering how far we'll get before we fall in. It doesn't sound much like the God who loved us enough to watch his son die so we didn't have to perish.

The whole "coming down on Monday" is very much a spiritualised version of the runner's high you mention, which is what makes it harmful when some within the church say that the high is God's presence. It's the kind of teaching that can so easily lead people to feel endlessly disillusioned with the God who never seems to stay with them, with a faith that seems to set them up for perpetual failure, and wondering what is wrong with them because they just can't seem to stay in God's presence for more than a few hours at a time. I remember going around that cycle several times in my teenage years, so it always bothers me these days when people (particularly younger people) talk of things that are little more than huge gigs as if they were some amazing spiritual experience. Been there, done that, ate the T-shirt....

Obviously I don't know you in any more detail than you've shared on the board but from what you're writing in this post it sounds like you've got a combination of a sense of God's love and forgiveness, and some other feelings coming from somewhere else. When you get that sort of thing going on, fall back on Scripture and test things against Scripture. If something is true it will withstand testing; if it is not true it's good to get rid of it sooner rather than later.

Andrew · Nov 29, 2017

tango said:
The stern father ready to smite you if you step even slightly out of line doesn't sound very much like the loving God of the Bible, does it? Touching on what you said earlier about holy living I wonder if that's something that has taken a good concept and turned it into something unhealthy. Yes, we should be holy, we should strive to live a holy life, but the idea that God is sitting watching us ready to smite us if we do the smallest thing wrong doesn't seem very helpful to me. It paints the picture that some seem to truly carry around of God as some kind of cosmic sadist watching us walk a tightrope over the fiery furnace, wondering how far we'll get before we fall in. It doesn't sound much like the God who loved us enough to watch his son die so we didn't have to perish.

The whole "coming down on Monday" is very much a spiritualised version of the runner's high you mention, which is what makes it harmful when some within the church say that the high is God's presence. It's the kind of teaching that can so easily lead people to feel endlessly disillusioned with the God who never seems to stay with them, with a faith that seems to set them up for perpetual failure, and wondering what is wrong with them because they just can't seem to stay in God's presence for more than a few hours at a time. I remember going around that cycle several times in my teenage years, so it always bothers me these days when people (particularly younger people) talk of things that are little more than huge gigs as if they were some amazing spiritual experience. Been there, done that, ate the T-shirt....

Obviously I don't know you in any more detail than you've shared on the board but from what you're writing in this post it sounds like you've got a combination of a sense of God's love and forgiveness, and some other feelings coming from somewhere else. When you get that sort of thing going on, fall back on Scripture and test things against Scripture. If something is true it will withstand testing; if it is not true it's good to get rid of it sooner rather than later.

Good advice. Maybe smite is a bit much to use as a description of the stern father type, perhaps there is a duality like you stated, I get reassurance that everything is going be alright and that I am forgiven after every episode of strong condemnation over little things. thanks tango.

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Andrew · Nov 29, 2017

I just want to state regardless of my changing views in the church, that it is a blessed church but its young, in need of much work and should look earnestly in the letters to the 7 churches in revelation for guidance, their works are not perfect and they lack credible doctrine. God keeps bringing me back to pentecostal churches, first time was 3 years ago when I got saved out of nowhere in the center of town square (did not even know it was pentecostal) and again very recently where once again my faith strengthened evermore so. I believe the Holy Spirit is guiding me to sup with Christ as in to know him rather than having a mixed lukewarm church kind of experience, hence why I am seeing the falsehoods or lack of leadership roles abiding sound doctrine within in the church.
If they are ever going to get out of the "cult" name tag they need to accept Trinity (which is ALSO accepting the Christian brotherhood), they need to stop teaching speaking tongues as the evidence of receiving the Holy Spirit and they need to stop preaching on good works and start teaching on the work on the cross.
I see the light is very dim already so its really up to the church to notice and repent, as for me I'll go wherever God leads me.

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Doubts in my Church

Albion

Well-known member

Andrew

Matt 18:15

tango

... and you shall live ...

Andrew

Matt 18:15

Andrew

Matt 18:15