• Amused
  • Angry
  • Annoyed
  • Awesome
  • Bemused
  • Cool
  • Crazy
  • Crying
  • Depressed
  • Down
  • Embarrassed
  • Enraged
  • Friendly
  • Geeky
  • Grumpy
  • Happy
  • Hungry
  • Innocent
  • Meh
  • Piratey
  • Poorly
  • Sad
  • Secret
  • Shy
  • Sneaky
  • Tired
  • Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
    Results 21 to 30 of 48
    1. #21
      tango's Avatar
      tango is offline Bronze Member
      Valued Contributor
      Supporting Member
      Married
      ... and you shall live ...
       
      Mood:
      Bemused
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Location
      Elsewhere
      Posts
      5,935
      CH Cash
      1,499
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (3,305,517 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      27,572
      Level
      45
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      31.72%
      Rep Power
      695
      Quote Originally Posted by DHoffmann View Post
      Thats true, I honestly feel that a counter weapon would eventually replace guns if they banned them. The rock was the very first technology used for killing another man (Cain and Abel) and anyone can look online on how to make explosives out of household items. I suggested the bullet theory because I heard Chris Rock once going on about it after columbine. I always wondered if it could be actually taken seriously, they can always practise with blanks, yet I know man from the backwoods that makes his own bullets from sulfate compounds
      Ultimately if someone has given up on their life to the extent they just want to take out a lot of people before they go down, they'll find a way whatever you make illegal. Since murder is illegal already the choice of weapon really isn't legally relevant - a gun might be a convenient way to kill a lot of people quickly but would a situation like the Pulse nightclub be any better had it been a nutter running around swinging a meat cleaver? It's more to the point to understand why and how people reach a place where an atrocity is something they actually want to create, rather than fussing over just what method they happen to use to achieve their goal.

      Although it's something of a cliche, in England when some nutjob drove a truck into people on London Bridge and then apparently the driver was running around with a big knife (as is often the case with this sort of thing, reports vary), the weapon control legislation in England made absolutely sure nobody was able to fight back. The motto handed around at the time was "run, hide, tell" whereas it's more often said among gun owners that a faster approach may be "drop, draw, fire".

      Needless to say it's not as simple as the one-liners from both sides. If we take the more left-leaning approach we end up with a ridiculous situation like in the UK where all sorts of things are banned, to the point it's impossible to effectively defend yourself against a dog or other animal, let alone an aggressive human. If we take the more right-leaning approach we end up with silly cliches where the solution to a bad guy with a meat cleaver is a good guy with a meat cleaver.

      Personally, on balance, I'd rather have the right to defend myself using whatever force is necessary, rather than worrying that if I ever did defend myself the chances are I'd become a de facto criminal for having a weapon with which to do so in the first place.
      "Do what thou will shall be the whole of the law" - Aleister Crowley

      "If you love me, obey my commandments" - Jesus Christ

      The Bible comes as a complete package. If we want to pluck verses out of context so make them mean what we want them to mean, if we want to ignore the passages that are inconvenient to our outlook, we should be intellectually honest enough to throw our Bibles in the trash and admit we are following Crowley and not Christ.

    2. #22
      tango's Avatar
      tango is offline Bronze Member
      Valued Contributor
      Supporting Member
      Married
      ... and you shall live ...
       
      Mood:
      Bemused
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Location
      Elsewhere
      Posts
      5,935
      CH Cash
      1,499
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (3,305,517 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      27,572
      Level
      45
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      31.72%
      Rep Power
      695
      Quote Originally Posted by Imalive View Post
      Yes that works in Holland to forbid weapons, but not in America. Anyone can get a weapon if they want to there. What if they all ban them? Some psycho can hide one and noone will find out.
      They should have checked that guy. He had already been in prison a year for assaulting his wife and kid. In Holland they pay close attention to you then. We've had a bit too much dads killing their kids when the mom wanted a divorce. They treated me like the Gestapo because of that. I couldnt see my kids without supervision because I did a suicide attempt. Yet someone like that can walk free, be w his kid and buy weapons and post it on Facebook.
      The idea that anyone can get a weapon in the US is quite widespread but not true. If you've been convicted of a felony you can't necessarily get a gun. I know a guy who has three convictions for drunk driving and on that basis alone is prohibited from owning a handgun.

      Part of the problem is that the issue is far too politically charged to stand much chance of ever reaching a sensible conclusion. When some groups include things like suicides in the statistics relating to gun deaths (some sources list gun suicides as accounting anything up to 60-70% of gun deaths) it invariably makes a problem look far worse than it really is. Although a gun suicide is clearly a gun death it makes little sense to use the number of people who choose to end their own life using the convenience of a gun as justification to ban guns as if these were deaths inflicted on unwilling others. If someone wishes to end their own life a gun merely provides an easy way to do it, which means they don't need to jump from a tower block or leap in front of a moving train or whatever other means they may use. Then come things like hunting accidents and other accidents - again in an ideal world these would not happen but it's part of the risk of taking part in such activities. We don't call to ban cars every time a dozen people are killed in a pile-up, we don't call to ban mountaineering every time a group is lost in the mountains and later found dead, so why should hunting be so different?
      "Do what thou will shall be the whole of the law" - Aleister Crowley

      "If you love me, obey my commandments" - Jesus Christ

      The Bible comes as a complete package. If we want to pluck verses out of context so make them mean what we want them to mean, if we want to ignore the passages that are inconvenient to our outlook, we should be intellectually honest enough to throw our Bibles in the trash and admit we are following Crowley and not Christ.

    3. Likes Josiah, Asuk liked this post
    4. #23
      Stravinsk is offline Composer and Artist on Flat Earth
      45
      Widow/Widower
      Mood:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      Jan 2016
      Posts
      3,126
      Country
      Australia
      CH Cash
      4,289
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (14,625 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      12,689
      Level
      32
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      97.46%
      Rep Power
      0
      I think that everyone who feasts on animal flesh should work in a abattoir, armed only with a knife and their teeth.

      Spilling the blood of piglets and chicks and cows and ripping into them with their raw flesh and savoring all the blood and pus and gore. Then arm them with guns, and let humanity end itself with it's own violence.

      Rawr.

      In other news, I understand that in India violent criminals get a diet that is almost exclusively vegetarian. I don't know the statistics on how effective it is, or if there are any, but it is interesting if true.

    5. #24
      MennoSota is offline Expert Member
      Mood:
      ----
       
      Join Date
      Sep 2017
      Posts
      3,115
      CH Cash
      13,162
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (0 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      13,363
      Level
      33
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      69.23%
      Rep Power
      349
      The problem with evil is a difficult subject.
      Job 2
      [10]Should we accept only good things from the hand of God and never anything bad?
      As hard as it is to understand, the events that unfold in horrific evil are allowed by the hand of God. The first question is inevitably, "Why?", but the same question could be, "Why not?".
      Human corruption at its core is bent toward evil. We see it in Cain and we see it in all humanity. Romans 1 tells us that God gives humans up to their own destruction and that means that both saints and sinners reap the consequences of this corruption.
      As humans we are torn assunder by the physical end to a human life with whom we loved to share our time. A part of us dies when they die. We grieve that loss. We either curse God for the pain or we seek God through the pain. We ask God for peace and grace to express the goodness of God in the dark, dark threads that He has woven.
      Jesus tells us that God prunes us so we might produce more and better fruit. How might the events of this past Sunday be a work of pruning? What might be the purpose of the Almighty in allowing his saints to be sacrificed on the path of the cross?

    6. Likes Snerfle liked this post
    7. #25
      MoreCoffee's Avatar
      MoreCoffee is offline Silver Member
      Girding loins for the battle.
       
      Mood:
      Awesome
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Posts
      14,836
      CH Cash
      14,083
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (0 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      41,101
      Level
      53
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      2.42%
      Rep Power
      631
      Getting rid of guns is not intellectually difficult but USA people like their guns and distrust their governments so USA is not likely to ever get rid of guns and will continue to have mass shootings until USA culture changes sufficiently to end the mass shootings.
      Pope Gregory I was well known for his alms to the poor, and he gave quite generously of the riches donated to the Church by the wealthy people of Rome. Everything from money to land was given to the poor in some fashion. He made clear to his subordinates that their duty was to relieve the distress faced by the poor.

      He ordered his clergy to go out into the streets to find and care for the poor in person.

    8. #26
      Snerfle is offline Veteran Member
      Supporting Member
      Mood:
      Geeky
       
      Join Date
      Feb 2017
      Location
      In a house
      Posts
      1,646
      Country
      United States
      CH Cash
      123,904
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (0 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      10,004
      Level
      29
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      82.93%
      Rep Power
      204
      Quote Originally Posted by MennoSota View Post
      The problem with evil is a difficult subject.
      Job 2
      [10]Should we accept only good things from the hand of God and never anything bad?
      As hard as it is to understand, the events that unfold in horrific evil are allowed by the hand of God. The first question is inevitably, "Why?", but the same question could be, "Why not?".
      Human corruption at its core is bent toward evil. We see it in Cain and we see it in all humanity. Romans 1 tells us that God gives humans up to their own destruction and that means that both saints and sinners reap the consequences of this corruption.
      As humans we are torn assunder by the physical end to a human life with whom we loved to share our time. A part of us dies when they die. We grieve that loss. We either curse God for the pain or we seek God through the pain. We ask God for peace and grace to express the goodness of God in the dark, dark threads that He has woven.
      Jesus tells us that God prunes us so we might produce more and better fruit. How might the events of this past Sunday be a work of pruning? What might be the purpose of the Almighty in allowing his saints to be sacrificed on the path of the cross?
      Yes, and Ive already done both, (shaken my fist in anger at God...or the heavens, the sky, the devil, ppl, anything i could blame (and for much less valid reasons, shamefully)) and also sought Him through pain as well. (I recommend the latter, btw)

      Similar to what I posted in another thread....I agree with Mennosota here, we have to seek the Lord in prayer, see if and how we can help in these situations, meeting physical needs if possible, and point ppl to our God and Saviour Jesus Christ, His promise to save all who trust in Him, His gift of eternal life and His Kingdom where there'll be no more sin, pain, and tears of sorrow.

      We need to keep on lifting each other up to His throne of grace, to find His grace and mercy, strength and wisdom. There's no other name under heaven whereby we must be saved except Jesus, and He's given us the responsibilty to share His message of salvation, love, grace and truth, to a lost and hurting world. We need to stand together with our brothers and sisters in Christ, and we need Jesus to help us.
      ~Deliberate ignorance
      is anti-christian~

    9. Likes MennoSota, jsimms435 liked this post
    10. #27
      tango's Avatar
      tango is offline Bronze Member
      Valued Contributor
      Supporting Member
      Married
      ... and you shall live ...
       
      Mood:
      Bemused
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Location
      Elsewhere
      Posts
      5,935
      CH Cash
      1,499
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (3,305,517 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      27,572
      Level
      45
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      31.72%
      Rep Power
      695
      Quote Originally Posted by MoreCoffee View Post
      Getting rid of guns is not intellectually difficult but USA people like their guns and distrust their governments so USA is not likely to ever get rid of guns and will continue to have mass shootings until USA culture changes sufficiently to end the mass shootings.
      Except unless you solve the underlying problem (i.e. why people decide to do this sort of thing in the first place) then getting rid of guns won't actually solve anything.

      We've seen attacks elsewhere using trucks as weapons. The Boston Marathon was attacked with pressure cookers. The Tokyo subway was attacked with nerve gas. The London Underground was attacked with backpack bombs. A couple of London pubs were attacked with nail bombs. In the UK just about every time some nutjob went crazy with a particular tool there was talk of an outright ban on them, to the point that the pocket knife I routinely carry when in the US fails UK weapon control legislation on at least 3 counts and maybe more. To date my criminal activity consists of 0 assaults, 0 muggings, 0 robberies, 0 murders - the knife is a tool and nothing more. Yet in the UK my utterly uneventful criminal life counts for nothing against the fact that I might potentially harm someboy with my knife. This tool that nobody gives a second glance in the UK would almost certainly get me an automatic jail sentence in the UK just for carrying it in public.

      If we can't figure out what it is that causes people to go on killing sprees like this we're doing nothing more than tinkering at the edges if the best solution on offer is to ban the current weapon of choice. Firstly if someone really wants to do something like this they will find a weapon (perhaps unsurprisingly criminals don't care if something is illegal) and if it's not a gun it will be something else. If the person concerned isn't expecting to live through their spree (given that they end with either suicide, or "suicide by cop", or the rest of their life in jail, it's clear that people choosing this path have basically given up on life and accept their life as they knew it is finished one way or another) they won't care how many crimes they chalk up along the way so the force of law will have no deterrent effect at all.

      Getting rid of guns might not be intellectually difficult in concept. Good luck getting the criminals to hand in their unregistered guns. That's not going to happen any time soon.
      "Do what thou will shall be the whole of the law" - Aleister Crowley

      "If you love me, obey my commandments" - Jesus Christ

      The Bible comes as a complete package. If we want to pluck verses out of context so make them mean what we want them to mean, if we want to ignore the passages that are inconvenient to our outlook, we should be intellectually honest enough to throw our Bibles in the trash and admit we are following Crowley and not Christ.

    11. Likes psalms 91, Josiah, Asuk liked this post
    12. #28
      jsimms435's Avatar
      jsimms435 is offline Veteran Member
      Married
      Mood:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Posts
      2,285
      Country
      United States
      CH Cash
      2,463
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (0 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      13,624
      Level
      33
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      96.87%
      Rep Power
      403
      Quote Originally Posted by MoreCoffee View Post
      Getting rid of guns is not intellectually difficult but USA people like their guns and distrust their governments so USA is not likely to ever get rid of guns and will continue to have mass shootings until USA culture changes sufficiently to end the mass shootings.
      Getting rid of guns isn't going to solve the problem except that terrorists will find out ways to kill with swords, trucks, planes, chemical weapons and improvised explosive devices. The problem is the evil in people's hearts, not a gun.

    13. Likes Stravinsk, tango, Asuk liked this post
    14. #29
      MoreCoffee's Avatar
      MoreCoffee is offline Silver Member
      Girding loins for the battle.
       
      Mood:
      Awesome
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Posts
      14,836
      CH Cash
      14,083
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (0 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      41,101
      Level
      53
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      2.42%
      Rep Power
      631
      Quote Originally Posted by jsimms435 View Post
      Getting rid of guns isn't going to solve the problem except that terrorists will find out ways to kill with swords, trucks, planes, chemical weapons and improvised explosive devices. The problem is the evil in people's hearts, not a gun.
      The mass shooting in Las Vegas was not an Islamic terrorist inspired attack. The man who did it was in all likelihood just bad or insane or something else. He would not have been able to shoot from a room in a hotel high up with clear aim to the crowds without a gun. A truck would not have done it. Swords would not work from that distance. Chemical weapons may work but he had none he had guns. It was with guns that he killed so many. The same is true of the man who is the cause of the slaughter that this thread is about. He did it with a gun. He had more guns in his vehicle. He would not have been able to do it with swords. He would have failed with a truck because the building would have encumbered his ability to kill as he did. It was the ease with which a gun kills that enabled him to kill as many as he did in so short a time.
      Pope Gregory I was well known for his alms to the poor, and he gave quite generously of the riches donated to the Church by the wealthy people of Rome. Everything from money to land was given to the poor in some fashion. He made clear to his subordinates that their duty was to relieve the distress faced by the poor.

      He ordered his clergy to go out into the streets to find and care for the poor in person.

    15. #30
      jsimms435's Avatar
      jsimms435 is offline Veteran Member
      Married
      Mood:
      Cool
       
      Join Date
      Jul 2015
      Posts
      2,285
      Country
      United States
      CH Cash
      2,463
      Post Thanks / Like
      CH Cash
      (0 Banked)
      vBActivity - Stats
      Points
      13,624
      Level
      33
      vBActivity - Bars
      Lv. Percent
      96.87%
      Rep Power
      403
      Quote Originally Posted by MoreCoffee View Post
      The mass shooting in Las Vegas was not an Islamic terrorist inspired attack. The man who did it was in all likelihood just bad or insane or something else. He would not have been able to shoot from a room in a hotel high up with clear aim to the crowds without a gun. A truck would not have done it. Swords would not work from that distance. Chemical weapons may work but he had none he had guns. It was with guns that he killed so many. The same is true of the man who is the cause of the slaughter that this thread is about. He did it with a gun. He had more guns in his vehicle. He would not have been able to do it with swords. He would have failed with a truck because the building would have encumbered his ability to kill as he did. It was the ease with which a gun kills that enabled him to kill as many as he did in so short a time.
      I'm aware of the history of those events. My point is, that if guns had not been available that evil people still find ways to destroy

    16. Likes Asuk liked this post

    Bookmarks

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •